Mesothelioma Bill [HL]

My Lords, I am glad that these things happen to other people as well as to me. The Deputy Chairma...

My Lords, before there are any other contributions on this topic, it might save time if I respond...

My Lords, I hope the Committee will allow me to speak. I apologise for arriving late. My excuse i...

My Lords, we have added our Front Bench names to Amendments 1 and 4 and concur with the two amend...

My Lords—

Is the noble Lord—

I was going to withdraw.

Ah, I might say a few words. I hope that in my earlier intervention in the interests of saving a ...

Before the Minister sits down, perhaps he could put on the record a bit more about the imbalance ...

My Lords, the difficulty in doing such a negotiation is that this was pretty price-sensitive stuf...

My Lords, I certainly was not objecting to the meetings that were held with the insurance industr...

Moved by

Lord Howarth of Newport

7: Clause 2, page 1, line 16, at end insert—

“...

My Lords, the two amendments in this group, Amendments 7 and 8, would extend eligibility under th...

My Lords, before I comment on what the noble Lord, Lord Howarth, said, I declare my interests. I ...

My Lords, I support my noble friend’s amendments on this issue. I first became aware of this terr...

My Lords, I rise to support Amendment 8. I spent the greater part of my professional life practis...

My Lords, like my noble friend Lord Walton of Detchant, in my time as a Liverpool Member of Parli...

My Lords, I am very interested in the question of families being exposed to asbestos. I draw on m...

My Lords, I rise to speak very briefly in support of the amendments put forward by the noble Lord...

My Lords, I rise briefly to support both of my noble friend Lord Howarth’s amendments, and I do s...

My Lords, I have been discussing this Bill with a number of people in my former constituency. I w...

I am sure that the Minister will be grateful to know that I shall be brief. Unlike the many lawye...

My Lords, like many Members, I have the honour to have represented a shipyards constituency for o...

My Lords, I would like to add a few points to the very extensive and knowledgeable debate that ha...

I thank the noble Lord, Lord Howarth, for these amendments. Clearly, their intention is to make t...

When the Minister talks about a disproportionate burden, does he accept that for years and years,...

My Lords, there is a deep and difficult history to this of which, I suspect, everyone in this roo...

I am sorry to interrupt my noble friend, but was it always clear whether a person was covered by ...

That is a very important point. As the noble Lord, Lord McKenzie, was querying, some people will ...

If the noble Lord will forgive me, the state does not have a liability because it pulled the dirt...

My Lords, clearly I speak for the whole Government generally. The specifics of this are really fo...

Before we move on, perhaps I can pick the Minister up on the words that he used a moment ago, tha...

I am sorry; if I said that, I truncated some words. What I meant to say is that the Government do...

On that point, has the Minister seen the ABI briefing, where it says:

“There will only be a...

Well, my Lords, if I am cleared to speak to the insurance industry again by this Committee, I wil...

Before the Minister sits down, I ask him to define what the present circumstances are.

I really will have to come back on that. It sounds to me like quite a complicated legal position....

My Lords, I thank all noble Lords who have contributed to what we knew would be an important deba...

Moved by

Lord Howarth of Newport

9: Clause 2, page 1, line 17, leave out paragraph (b...

My Lords, we need alternates. I am looking forward to an imminent group where I shall have nothin...

My Lords, with his characteristic courtesy, earlier this week the Minister gave Members of the Co...

My Lords, I support these amendments. I am particularly attracted by the one tabled by my noble f...

My Lords, are people with mesothelioma covered by the Disability Discrimination Act? If not, they...

My Lords, I shall speak to Amendments 11 and 14 in my name and that of my noble friend Lord McKen...

Perhaps the Minister will allow me to make one last entry into this debate. I believe that I can ...

Given the noble Lord’s deep knowledge of this, since Equitas was set up to rescue Lloyd’s from th...

In the main, they are in the custody of what was the Department of Trade and Industry, because it...

Oh!

I am sorry, but that is a true story.

We are worrying about whether we have the files on th...

My Lords, we could spend a lot of time on this. I was at Warburg when it helped to sort out Equit...

The Minister is again speaking of reserving for the liabilities. I am grateful to the noble Lord,...

What happens is that insurers have to provide that they have sufficient funds to meet their liabi...

Can the Minister expand on that point? I understand the need to provide for liabilities, but is t...

What the insurer has to do, as I understand it, is to provide for future liabilities. Through an ...

I am sure that shortly the Minister will give us an assurance that he will provide the figures th...

I would like to offer the Minister a way of reassuring us on this because we may be talking at cr...

I will double-check, my Lords, but my understanding is that a reserve from an insurance company i...

If I understand correctly the background papers to this scheme, particularly the impact assessmen...

That is one of the central issues with imposing a levy based on the existing market share. There ...

Will the Minister confirm whether the £119 million is gross or net of benefit recovery?

I think that it is net, but I will have to write with the right answer to that. I urge the noble ...

My Lords, this has been a valuable opportunity for us to begin to explore one of the most importa...

I remind the noble Lord that Equitas and Lloyd’s were dealing with reinsurance, not primary insur...

I certainly accept that point, but I also noted what the noble Lord, Lord James of Blackheath, sa...

Moved by

Lord Alton of Liverpool

10: Clause 2, page 1, line 17, leave out “25 July 20...

My Lords, Amendment 10 has already been dealt with in the debate we have just had, so my remarks ...

My Lords, it is a pleasure to follow the noble Lord, Lord Alton, particularly in the light of the...

My Lords, I, too, have put my name to Amendment 31. It is with some hesitation that I rise to spe...

My Lords, I, too, have added my name to Amendment 31. I thank the noble Lord, Lord Alton, for the...

My Lords, I support Amendment 31. In doing so, I declare my interest as professor of surgery at U...

My Lords, I, too, support Amendment 31, for all the reasons powerfully advanced by the noble Lord...

Does the noble Lord also recall the statutory ability to charge levies through organisations such...

The noble Lord is right. As I mentioned, there are other examples. Parliament imposes levies when...

My Lords, I add my thanks and congratulations to the noble Lord, Lord Alton of Liverpool, on tabl...

My Lords, I, too, put my name to the letter and I, too, support my noble friend’s amendment—at le...

My Lords, I, too, was one of the signatories of the letter that was drafted by the noble Lord, Lo...

My Lords, I hope that the Minister did not think that I was being flippant in my earlier interven...

My Lords, we support the concept of insurers contributing to fund research to find new treatments...

Well, my Lords, I feel like adding my name to the amendment.

I have spent an enormous amoun...

To clarify, is the noble Lord saying that the only impediment to including a provision of this so...

I have done quite a lot of work on this, as I have said, and talked to the department. I am sayin...

The question of whether the Department of Health wishes to do this is a separate matter but, on w...

I am not sure of the definition of illegality, but our powers are such that we cannot raise money...

I hope that the Minister will forgive me for interrupting him again but is he saying that the dep...

Is it not about time that we changed the policy, if it is policy, because surely now one wants to...

My Lords, the national research effort has been a great success in our country because it is stra...

Perhaps I may add a small point from my own field in medicine. One of the problems with mesotheli...

I take from this a weight of feeling and, bluntly, the best thing that I can do is to take it bac...

I think that we all recognise the Minister’s commitment to this issue. However, has any thought b...

To be honest, I do not think that we have looked at that as an option. I will have another look a...

When the Minister goes round the wheel again and has conversations with the Minister in the Cabin...

I have actually got round to asking that question already, so I can answer it now. The reason is ...

My Lords, the Minister said that he feels like a mad mouse going round in a wheel. Fortunately, w...

Moved by

Lord McKenzie of Luton

12: Clause 2, page 1, line 18, after “an” insert “suc...

My Lords, this is, I hope, a brief and probing amendment. To be eligible for a payment under the ...

My Lords, I support my noble friend’s amendment, although I think that there is a more elegant wa...

My Lords, as I understand it, the purpose of the amendment is that a person may be eligible for a...

My Lords, I am reluctant to intervene on the Minister when he is reading a very carefully constru...

Lord Freud: My Lords, what the legislation aims to do, and does, is to say, “Go to your relevant ...

The reason we are able to deal with these cases in this way is because of the history of the way ...

As I said, let me write to noble Lords about the necessity or otherwise of the first half of the ...

My Lords, I am grateful to my noble friend Lord Browne for his intervention and for challenging t...

Moved by

Lord McKenzie of Luton

13: Clause 2, page 2, line 20, at end insert “but sha...

My Lords, Amendment 13 is another probing amendment which addresses another aspect of eligibility...

I thank the noble Lord for the amendments. The intention of Amendment 13 is to ensure that a pers...

I believe I am right in interpreting that there are cases that could get compensation for diffuse...

The noble Lord is raising a slightly different question. What we are looking at here is the quest...

I am grateful to the noble Lord for his explanation. It has confirmed the position, which was the...

We do not have the legislation to match. I am not sure that, off the top of my head, I can be pre...

I am grateful to the noble Lord and happy to receive a letter in due course. I beg leave to withd...

Moved by

Lord McKenzie of Luton

15: Clause 4, page 3, line 4, at end insert “but shal...

My Lords, as the Minister will be aware, while I am supportive of the scheme that he brings forwa...

My Lords, my Amendment 18 is grouped with Amendment 15, just moved by my noble friend Lord McKenz...

My Lords, I certainly agree with the noble Lord, Lord Howarth, about the incentive argument. I th...

My Lords, the fact that we are at a late stage of the debate today should not stop us from speaki...

My Lords, I, too, support the amendments. I very much agree with my noble friend on the Front Ben...

My Lords, briefly, we are being presented with the alternatives of finding the paperwork, in whic...

My Lords, the amendment seeks to set the rate of payment at 100% of the average civil award amoun...

I understand that argument, but can I put two other considerations to the noble Lord? When the Ll...

It is always a dangerous thing to base it on a moral argument, particularly in this area. It is a...

My Lords, I thank the Minister for his reply, none of which comes as a surprise. I thank all nobl...

Perhaps I may quickly clear up that matter. When you look at the totals, you have to take into ac...

I accept that point, but is not part of the smoothing in the early years being done by government...

It is a very small amount. We will actually do the smoothing over the years. Turning round the re...

I think that £17 million is the cost of the government contribution. I still do not think that we...

Does the noble Lord wish to withdraw the amendment?

I do not know whether the Minister has anything further to say.

I simply urge the noble Lord to withdraw the amendment.

Before I do, is the Minister going to say anything about the MoJ consultation?

There is not much that I can add to what I said at Second Reading. Clearly, there is a consultati...

Can the Minister just say whether any of that featured in the discussions and negotiations that h...

Yes. It was important to the industry that the MoJ undertook to look at those issues. That was re...

I shall read the record on that and I may return to the point in due course. However, given the h...