UK Parliament / Open data

Animal Welfare Bill

Debate on bills on Tuesday, 14 March 2006, in the House of Commons, led by Ben Bradshaw. The answering member was Bill Wiggin.
Animal Welfare Bill. Report stage debate. New clause 8 debated and agreed to. Amendment to New clause 8 negatived. New clause 9, debated with new clauses 4 and 5, agreed to. Amendment to new clause 9 negatived. New clause 2, debated with new clause 6, negatived. Amendments made to the Bill. Queen's Consent signified. Third reading debate agreed to on question and Bill passed.

About these Parliamentary proceedings

Reference

443 c1330-1427 

Session

2005-06

Department

Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs

Legislative stage

Third reading and Report stage

Procedure

New clauses
Queen's consent

Chamber / Committee

House of Commons chamber

Related items

Animal Welfare Bill . As amended in Standing Committee A
Thursday, 26 January 2006
Bills
House of Commons
Animal Welfare: Dogs’ Tails
Tuesday, 2 May 2006
Written questions
House of Lords

Proceeding contributions

Shona McIsaac | 443 c1391, (corrigendum) 1582 (Link to this contribution) Apparently Ming is led into the ring and forced to drink some milk as part of his performance. [Hon....
Lembit Opik | 443 c1335 (Link to this contribution) I support the Government’s new clause, but does the Minister accept the view that I take—that a blan...

Show all contributions (270)
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1336 (Link to this contribution) That was the point. The reason I am supporting the exemption is that I partly agree with the hon. Ge...
John Redwood | 443 c1335 (Link to this contribution) My question relates to the Minister’s earlier point. I believe that in many cases people cannot deci...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1335 (Link to this contribution) In the end, we will have to leave it to the courts to decide whether the intention at the time was f...
Peter Atkinson | 443 c1334 (Link to this contribution) Would I be prosecuted if I went to a rescue centre and bought a dog with a docked tail that was born...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1334-5 (Link to this contribution) Not if the tail had been docked legally. [Interruption.] The hon. Gentleman would not be responsible...
Bob Spink | 443 c1336 (Link to this contribution) Before the Minister moves on from specific breeds, will he confirm that it is possible for cross bre...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1336 (Link to this contribution) I will give hon. Members a further insight into the breeds that we would consider if the new clause ...
Eric Martlew | 443 c1336 (Link to this contribution) I may be wrong, but I think that I heard my hon. Friend say that there was an exemption for working ...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1336 (Link to this contribution) No, I will not name the breeds now. That will be subject to regulation, but the breeds will be named...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1333 (Link to this contribution) Yes, of course. I am about to explain some of the safeguards in a little more detail, but I am happy...
Richard Ottaway | 443 c1333 (Link to this contribution) New clause 8, on my reading of it, relates to dogs. What is the position for other animals—cats and,...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1333 (Link to this contribution) That is all in the Bill. There is a general prohibition on mutilation, with exemptions that will be ...
James Paice | 443 c1333 (Link to this contribution) For the benefit of my hon. Friends and other hon. Members, will the Minister confirm that if new cla...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1333-4 (Link to this contribution) Yes. The vet would issue the owner with a certificate showing that the dog had been docked legitima...
Rob Marris | 443 c1334 (Link to this contribution) One could drive a coach and horses through the regulations on law enforcement by taking a four-year-...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1334 (Link to this contribution) There would not be any circumstances under which a four-year-old could have its tail docked. [Interr...
John Bercow | 443 c1334 (Link to this contribution) I am glad that the Minister has abandoned his self-denying ordinance, because I did not have the pri...
Speaker | 443 c1331 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss the following: Amendment (a) to new clause 8, in line 13...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1331-2 (Link to this contribution) The purpose of the first part of our deliberations this afternoon is to facilitate a debate and then...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1331 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.
David Drew | 443 c1332-3 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry to interrupt so early in my hon. Friend’s explanation. However, the law is very clear tha...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1333 (Link to this contribution) I shall come to some of the extra safeguards that we have put into the new clause in a minute, but t...
James Paice | 443 c1339 (Link to this contribution) Forgive me, but I think that this is a debate. However, I am grateful to the Minister for giving way...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1339 (Link to this contribution) I will give way a final time, because this is turning into a debate.
Evan Harris | 443 c1337-8 (Link to this contribution) Does the Minister recognise the difference between carefully formulated scientific evidence and the ...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1337 (Link to this contribution) As I have said, there is no such thing as absolute certainty, which is why I am sure that some hon. ...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1338 (Link to this contribution) I was interested in what my hon. Friend said about the police. I understand that the police have som...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1338 (Link to this contribution) It has long been the view of the majority of the council of the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons...
David Leslie Taylor | 443 c1338 (Link to this contribution) If we are talking about scientific evidence, surely the Minister should tell the House what proporti...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1338 (Link to this contribution) It may help if I quote from the letter dated 9 March that I received from Assistant Chief Constable ...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1338 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend will have to forgive me, but I do not know what proportion of working dogs Assistant ...
Andrew Love | 443 c1337 (Link to this contribution) I thank my hon. Friend for eventually giving way. I am a complete novice in this matter and want to ...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1337 (Link to this contribution) Yes. The new clause does not include such breeds. The best answer to that problem is to clean the do...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1337 (Link to this contribution) Has the Minister considered the case of the old English sheepdog, which used to be a working dog? Ma...
Paddy Tipping | 443 c1337 (Link to this contribution) The Minister has made my point for me. Working dogs are used for far more than shooting, and there a...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1336-7 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend the Minister for Climate Change and the Environment says from a sedentary position th...
Lord Wills | 443 c1336 (Link to this contribution) Will my hon. Friend clarify the evidence on which he has formulated the proposed exemption? What is ...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1337 (Link to this contribution) I give way to the hon. Member for Kettering (Mr. Hollobone).
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1337 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend may have received a letter from Assistant Chief Constable Peter Vaughan, who is the A...
Bill Wiggin | 443 c1340 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes an excellent point, and is absolutely right. We should not make decisions based...
Baroness Browning | 443 c1340 (Link to this contribution) Is it not the case that a great many veterinary surgeons today specialise purely in companion animal...
Bill Wiggin | 443 c1340 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for agreeing that that is the nub of the problem. If he is right...
David Drew | 443 c1340 (Link to this contribution) That is the crux of the problem. Tail docking is not taught in veterinary schools any more, and the ...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1339 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman makes a very good point. I hope that he will forgive me—I was not trying to say t...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1339 (Link to this contribution) The Scots have not yet legislated on the matter, but, in theory, my hon. Friend is right and that wo...
Bill Wiggin | 443 c1339-40 (Link to this contribution) First, let me welcome the attack of common sense that the Government seem to have had since the Bill...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1339 (Link to this contribution) This really is the final time that I will give way and then I will conclude.
Jim McGovern | 443 c1339 (Link to this contribution) I understand that a ban already exists in Scotland. If the same does not apply in England, it will l...
Lembit Opik | 443 c1342 (Link to this contribution) I was going to make a rather similar point to the hon. Member for Tiverton and Honiton (Angela Brown...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1342 (Link to this contribution) I must admit that when I was preparing the notes for my speech, my mind had not actually wandered on...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1342-3 (Link to this contribution) The definition of a mutilation is not mine. I cited it because it is the veterinary profession’s des...
Lord Bellingham | 443 c1341 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is speaking with a great deal of knowledge and a lot of experience, and most eloquent...
Bill Wiggin | 443 c1341 (Link to this contribution) I urge my hon. Friend not to be too modest with his praise for me; I am most grateful for it. What h...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1341-2 (Link to this contribution) I am pleased to be able to participate in the debate. I will focus on the reasons why I believe that...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1342 (Link to this contribution) I am happy to take interventions, but I would appreciate it if I could make a wee bit of progress fi...
Baroness Browning | 443 c1342 (Link to this contribution) I have been persuaded by the Minister on new clause 8. When considering the surgical procedure for t...
Martyn Jones | 443 c1356 (Link to this contribution) I was trying to work out the numbers while the hon. Gentleman was speaking, but at least four member...
Lord Bellingham | 443 c1356 (Link to this contribution) I am interested in what the hon. Gentleman has said, which carries some weight, although I have disc...
Nick Palmer | 443 c1356 (Link to this contribution) : The hon. Gentleman and I share the pleasure of having a labrador. Would it not be logical to say t...
Lord Bellingham | 443 c1356 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman slightly devalues his argument with his rather flippant remark. My point is that ...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1354 (Link to this contribution) I have engaged in two lengthy conversations with Assistant Chief Constable Vaughan. He is under no i...
Martyn Jones | 443 c1355 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is absolutely right and makes the point perfectly that that is not an argument in fav...
Lord Bellingham | 443 c1355 (Link to this contribution) : It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Clwyd, South (Mr. Jones) and it is sad that we are ...
Martyn Jones | 443 c1355 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend the Member for North-West Leicestershire (David Taylor) asks from a sedentary positio...
Eric Martlew | 443 c1355 (Link to this contribution) : Does my hon. Friend agree that it is unlikely that the police would dock a five-day-old puppy that...
Peter Atkinson | 443 c1353 (Link to this contribution) I entirely agree. It is dangerous to be blinkered when faced with these issues, but when it comes to...
Martyn Jones | 443 c1353-4 (Link to this contribution) : Originally, I was open-minded. I generally support shooting and field sports. Three or four weeks ...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1354 (Link to this contribution) Is my hon. Friend aware that most of the dogs used by the police are gifted to them? Their tails may...
Martyn Jones | 443 c1354 (Link to this contribution) That is a point, but the fact remains that most of the dogs’ tails have not been docked to avoid dam...
James Paice | 443 c1354 (Link to this contribution) : Given my own view, I am rather sorry that the hon. Gentleman has reached this conclusion. He asked...
Martyn Jones | 443 c1354 (Link to this contribution) Not at all. I still cannot see the logic. That is the opinion of a particular police officer who has...
Peter Atkinson | 443 c1353 (Link to this contribution) As my hon. Friends are saying, border collies do not tend to go down holes, and foxhounds are not in...
Peter Atkinson | 443 c1353 (Link to this contribution) I am about to end my speech, but I will give way.
Lord Soames of Fletching | 443 c1353 (Link to this contribution) One of the depressing aspects of legislation of this kind is the House’s inability to listen to the ...
David Drew | 443 c1361 (Link to this contribution) In the short time I have left, I shall try to be consistent. My hon. Friend the Minister has changed...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1361 (Link to this contribution) I point out to the hon. Gentleman and others who have suggested that a possible solution may be to b...
Mark Harper | 443 c1361 (Link to this contribution) I still think that exploring that route would be beneficial, instead of having a ban. When we were ...
Lord Cormack | 443 c1361 (Link to this contribution) Has my hon. Friend had a satisfactory assurance from the Minister in that regard?
Anne Snelgrove | 443 c1360 (Link to this contribution) We are told that an exemption would mean that a vet would have to certify that the dog is likely to ...
Mark Harper | 443 c1360-1 (Link to this contribution) : I had planned to vote for new clause 8, but having listened to the debate and to the Minister’s pr...
Anne Snelgrove | 443 c1360 (Link to this contribution) I have indications from vets in my constituency that the number of injuries to dogs whose tails were...
Speaker | 443 c1360 (Link to this contribution) Order. May I remind the House that we must not have casual conversations while the hon. Lady is addr...
Russell Brown | 443 c1359-60 (Link to this contribution) : A local vet in my constituency produced two letters, one dated 1991 and the other 1997, from the S...
Lord Bellingham | 443 c1358 (Link to this contribution) I am going to sit down in a moment. This is yet another example of this Government saying one thing ...
Anne Snelgrove | 443 c1358-9 (Link to this contribution) As a member of the Standing Committee that considered the Bill, I want to thank the Minister for the...
Nick Palmer | 443 c1359 (Link to this contribution) I was unable to read the full Committee proceedings, but am I right in believing that a substantial ...
Anne Snelgrove | 443 c1359 (Link to this contribution) That is entirely correct. Those who reached a decision one way or another—that did not include the C...
Lord Bellingham | 443 c1357 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. Lady for that intervention. I am not going to pursue this issue in detail,...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1357 (Link to this contribution) I can assure the hon. Gentleman and the House that I have never given any assurances on anything to ...
Lord Bellingham | 443 c1357-8 (Link to this contribution) That is very interesting, because according to an article in The Times in 2004, the Minister had ass...
David S Borrow | 443 c1358 (Link to this contribution) : Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Lord Bellingham | 443 c1357 (Link to this contribution) She has. I have seen puppies being docked by vets and I do not feel that there is any lasting pain. ...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1357 (Link to this contribution) Does the hon. Gentleman accept that scientific evidence demonstrates that the neonatal puppy experie...
Anne Main | 443 c1345 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady is worried about tail docking not having any purpose because it falls within the remit...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1346 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend cited the letter from the president of the RCVS, so it is only fair to say that my of...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1345 (Link to this contribution) Yes, but the debate is about tail docking. The hon. Lady did not serve on the Committee, and those w...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1346 (Link to this contribution) Of course the royal college will follow the law, but it has pointed out to me and other Members of P...
Paddy Tipping | 443 c1346 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend has been generous in giving way, but I am sure that she is conscious that many other ...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1346 (Link to this contribution) I thank my hon. Friend for that intervention but I do not know when he last discussed the matter wit...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1346-7 (Link to this contribution) I have already given way to the hon. Gentleman. I know that other hon. Members want to speak—[Hon. M...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1343 (Link to this contribution) As I continue with my arguments, I hope that my hon. Friend will find that there are compelling reas...
Lynne Jones | 443 c1343 (Link to this contribution) I share the distaste for docking and regard it as a mutilation. I had intended to vote for a complet...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1343 (Link to this contribution) I did think about the issue of circumcision, because I received what I can only describe as racist a...
Richard Ottaway | 443 c1343 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady may not have had horse castration in mind when she came to the Chamber, but has she co...
Bill Wiggin | 443 c1343 (Link to this contribution) I was just sitting here quietly minding my own business—but the hon. Lady’s point about crustaceans ...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1344 (Link to this contribution) Yes. The ACPO material is anecdotal—it is not based on scientific fact and has not been peer reviewe...
Martyn Jones | 443 c1344 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that it seems a little strange to use the ACPO evidence, or so-called evid...
Lord Bellingham | 443 c1344 (Link to this contribution) I should declare an interest. My family have kept springer and cocker spaniels over the years, some ...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1344-5 (Link to this contribution) I thank the hon. Gentleman for that comment, but I still do not believe that it answers the question...
Peter Atkinson | 443 c1351-2 (Link to this contribution) The answer to the hon. Gentleman’s point is that the evidence is not conclusive on either side, whic...
Norman Baker | 443 c1351 (Link to this contribution) I hope that history will look on us and see that we have shown some interest in animals, which is a ...
Peter Atkinson | 443 c1351 (Link to this contribution) : I will be brief—I know that many other hon. Members want to take part in this short debate—and I s...
Russell Brown | 443 c1353 (Link to this contribution) The House has discussed various types of working dog today, including hounds used in hunting. The mo...
Peter Atkinson | 443 c1352-3 (Link to this contribution) I am no expert on the breeding of dogs, but if that is possible, it would certainly present a soluti...
David Leslie Taylor | 443 c1352 (Link to this contribution) : Could not breeding societies be encouraged to breed dogs with the aim of producing shorter tails? ...
Peter Atkinson | 443 c1352 (Link to this contribution) I agree with my hon. Friend. I do not think that legislation is needed, but I believe that show orga...
Mark Harper | 443 c1352 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend has hit on a point there. I have changed my mind, having listened to the debate. I wa...
Peter Atkinson | 443 c1352 (Link to this contribution) The point I am getting at is that it becomes difficult to legislate precisely for all those issues. ...
Nick Palmer | 443 c1352 (Link to this contribution) I admire the hon. Gentleman’s consistency on the matter, but does he not agree, whichever side of th...
David S Borrow | 443 c1347-8 (Link to this contribution) What would be the motivation for someone who breeds dogs to dock their tails deliberately if there w...
Norman Baker | 443 c1347 (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for the manner in which he has handled this controversial matter, both by enabl...
Paddy Tipping | 443 c1350 (Link to this contribution) Of course I have seen the RCVS letter and I have had discussions with the RCVS. I want to make the p...
Nick Palmer | 443 c1349-50 (Link to this contribution) On that point, has my hon. Friend seen the letter from the RCVS? On whether a puppy is likely to be ...
David S Borrow | 443 c1350 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that there is a difference between tail docking and full tail amputation, ...
Evan Harris | 443 c1349 (Link to this contribution) : As my hon. Friend is standing down from his Front-Bench position, may I take this opportunity to p...
Norman Baker | 443 c1348-9 (Link to this contribution) I agree that there would be less motivation. If they were working dogs under the provisions of new c...
Paddy Tipping | 443 c1349 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to be able to speak in this debate and to be able to support my hon. Friend the Under-...
Norman Baker | 443 c1349 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is absolutely right. In fact, he has stolen my conclusion from me. It is for those wh...
Greg Knight | 443 c1373 (Link to this contribution) Is not the word ““may”” commonly used in such circumstances? Is it not a way of drafting designed to...
Humfrey Malins | 443 c1373 (Link to this contribution) I wish to intervene briefly on this matter to support my hon. Friend the Member for Leominster (Bill...
Bill Wiggin | 443 c1372-3 (Link to this contribution) I have fought for the inclusion of the improvement notice in the Bill, and I am pleased that the Gov...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1371 (Link to this contribution) Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker. This amendment to the Bill reflects my agreement in Committee to con...
Speaker | 443 c1370 (Link to this contribution) Order. We now have to get on with the next new clause. Will Members who are leaving do so quietly an...
Speaker | 443 c1370 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss the following: Amendment (a) to new clause 9, in line 2,...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1370 (Link to this contribution) This amendment to the Bill reflects—[Interruption.]
David Drew | 443 c1361-2 (Link to this contribution) At least the Liberal Democrats have been consistent, although the hon. Member for Lewes (Norman Bake...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1370 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1361 (Link to this contribution) I have not changed my position once on this issue.
David Drew | 443 c1374 (Link to this contribution) I largely agree with the hon. Gentleman. My only worry is that the treatment of an animal may not im...
Bill Wiggin | 443 c1374 (Link to this contribution) If that is the hon. Gentleman’s dilemma and he is worried that he cannot decide without the court’s ...
Bill Wiggin | 443 c1375 (Link to this contribution) The point that the hon. Gentleman is making is valid if there were a prosecution for cruelty. If neg...
Colin Breed | 443 c1375 (Link to this contribution) I thought that I understood the provision until I heard the last few exchanges. I, too, served on th...
Humfrey Malins | 443 c1373-4 (Link to this contribution) It is kind of my hon. Friend to say so, but if a defendant said, ““I must tell you, your honour, tha...
David Drew | 443 c1374 (Link to this contribution) I would be grateful if the Minister clarified the provision. I was lucky to serve on the Standing Co...
Bill Wiggin | 443 c1374 (Link to this contribution) We share common ground on the issue of cruelty and the need to tackle it urgently. The new clause, h...
David Drew | 443 c1374 (Link to this contribution) I agree, but there are gradations. What appears to be a welfare offence to one person is straightfor...
Humfrey Malins | 443 c1373 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend, as always, makes an interesting point. Of course, an alternative for the word ...
Greg Knight | 443 c1376 (Link to this contribution) Should there not, though, be a provision to challenge the issuing of a notice? There may be a case w...
Colin Breed | 443 c1376 (Link to this contribution) I wish it did. We are considering a range of cases, and some are more subjective than others. We on ...
Bill Wiggin | 443 c1376 (Link to this contribution) If the inspector is of the opinion that a person is failing to comply with clause 8, that means that...
Andrew Turner | 443 c1375-6 (Link to this contribution) I have listened carefully to the arguments advanced by the hon. Gentleman and, indeed, by my hon. Fr...
Ann Widdecombe | 443 c1376 (Link to this contribution) It depends on how much exercise they have.
Colin Breed | 443 c1375 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman. We may be talking about only one word, but that word is signifi...
Andrew Turner | 443 c1376 (Link to this contribution) Indeed, Madam Deputy Speaker. Can the hon. Member for South-East Cornwall (Mr. Breed) say whether, a...
Colin Breed | 443 c1376 (Link to this contribution) Broadly, yes. The discretion should be with the officer who is confronted with each individual situa...
Andrew Turner | 443 c1376 (Link to this contribution) Indeed, but does that allow them to exhibit, in the words of—
Speaker | 443 c1376 (Link to this contribution) Order. Is the hon. Gentleman able to bring his remarks to a close?
Speaker | 443 c1381-4 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss the following: New clause 6—Abandonment— '(1) A person ...
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1381 (Link to this contribution) : I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.
Colin Breed | 443 c1376-7 (Link to this contribution) That would cause the situation to escalate even further. If it is possible to challenge whether the ...
Bob Spink | 443 c1377 (Link to this contribution) : I do not want to rain on anyone’s parade. Broadly, clause 8 is a good clause and is improved by th...
Speaker | 443 c1377 (Link to this contribution) Order. The hon. Gentleman is going wide of the amendment under discussion.
Bob Spink | 443 c1377 (Link to this contribution) Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. Can the Minister find a way to address that issue in the context of...
Peter Ainsworth | 443 c1377 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend should be aware that the Bill does not apply to farm animals, which is perhaps why th...
Bob Spink | 443 c1377 (Link to this contribution) I take that advice. Clause 8(2)(c) calls for the animal "““to be able to exhibit normal behaviour ...
Bill Wiggin | 443 c1377 (Link to this contribution) The extreme use of an electric shock collar would be deemed to be cruelty, in which case the inspect...
Bob Spink | 443 c1377 (Link to this contribution) Having received those clarifications, I am happy to draw my remarks to a close and hope that I can s...
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1391 (Link to this contribution) I am intrigued by what the hon. Lady said about—allegedly—an alligator going into the circus. I am l...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1391 (Link to this contribution) I said that I would be brief. I wanted to be brief when we discussed tail docking. I will give way a...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1391 (Link to this contribution) That is not how I interpret the new clause, or how the people with whom I have been working interpre...
Andrew Turner | 443 c1391 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady is misinterpreting her own new clause. The effect of subsection (1) is to ban the keep...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1390-1 (Link to this contribution) Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. Subsection (2) says that there must be scientific evidence to show...
Speaker | 443 c1390 (Link to this contribution) Order. The hon. Gentleman knows that interventions must be brief. He might have an opportunity later...
Andrew Turner | 443 c1390 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. Lady for allowing me to intervene; I have two reasons for doing so. First,...
Andrew Turner | 443 c1390 (Link to this contribution) Yes, it would. It says: "““A person commits an offence if he uses or keeps in, or for the purposes ...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1389 (Link to this contribution) I am trying to answer the hon. Member for Castle Point (Bob Spink). What I am trying to say is, ““Le...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1390 (Link to this contribution) As ever, the right hon. Lady makes her point superbly and succinctly. I wish that I were as superb a...
Ann Widdecombe | 443 c1389-90 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. Lady for allowing me to intervene, and I wish to take her back to the argu...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1389 (Link to this contribution) I have tried not to be prescriptive in the new clause, because of the nature of our debate in Standi...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1389 (Link to this contribution) I am trying to be objective. I have my own view, and I do not believe that the welfare needs of anim...
Bob Spink | 443 c1389 (Link to this contribution) Does the hon. Lady have some idea of what she is talking about? Give us some names.
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1388-9 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman tempts me on that. Yes, I did read those comments. They came from a circus that i...
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1388 (Link to this contribution) I have a lot of sympathy with the hon. Lady’s new clause. Will she join me in condemning those circu...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1388 (Link to this contribution) Given what happened in the debate on tail docking, I do not want to take up the House’s time by allo...
Bob Spink | 443 c1389 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady is being very generous in giving way. Will she be generous enough to acknowledge that ...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1388 (Link to this contribution) I have read a far larger body of evidence that challenges those findings. That was one particular ex...
Peter Luff | 443 c1388 (Link to this contribution) I want to ask the hon. Lady a genuine question. I am seeking her view, not trying to make a point. T...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1388 (Link to this contribution) I have seen the amendment that the hon. Member for Mid-Worcestershire (Peter Luff) has tabled to the...
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1384-5 (Link to this contribution) It was, and I thank my hon. Friend for that intervention. In fact, the mountain leopard is also an e...
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1385-7 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right, but I would not wish to be adversarial today. I know that th...
Norman Baker | 443 c1385 (Link to this contribution) : I welcome the new clause and agree that the proposal is important. Does the hon. Gentleman agree t...
Lord Cormack | 443 c1387 (Link to this contribution) I presume that the Under-Secretary could also say that, if the conditions were right, the animal cou...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1387 (Link to this contribution) I want to speak to new clause 10, the subject of which is circus animals. We debated the matter on S...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1387-8 (Link to this contribution) Yes, of course. The new clause provides for it to be demonstrated that the animal’s welfare needs ar...
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1384 (Link to this contribution) The new clause is intended to end the sale of endangered animals on the internet. It follows on from...
Peter Luff | 443 c1400-1 (Link to this contribution) I half expected the Minister to have caught your eye by now, Mr. Deputy Speaker, as he might have th...
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1401 (Link to this contribution) Would my hon. Friend clarify the point that he is making and say whether there are any circumstances...
Peter Luff | 443 c1401-3 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend may shake his head in disbelief, but that is the scientific evidence. I want to put ...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1403 (Link to this contribution) I apologise to those Conservative Members who served in Committee if I do not respond to their speci...
Peter Luff | 443 c1401 (Link to this contribution) I do not want to get into a big debate about the evidence for and against the welfare benefits for a...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1403 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Member for The Wrekin (Mark Pritchard) moved new clause 2, which was supported by Conservat...
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1403 (Link to this contribution) Notwithstanding the Minister’s comments, prosecutions are not being brought under the existing legis...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1403 (Link to this contribution) I am not sure whether this is an intervention, a point of order or merely an inquiry, but I have not...
Speaker | 443 c1403 (Link to this contribution) Order. All that matters at this stage is that the lead amendment has been moved.
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1391-2 (Link to this contribution) I do not know whether the circus’s advertisement was successful, but other advertisements have been ...
Lord Cormack | 443 c1392 (Link to this contribution) From what was said by my hon. Friend the Member for Isle of Wight (Mr. Turner), it would appear that...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1392 (Link to this contribution) I take that point. As I have said, I want a certain result; that certain animals are not kept in tra...
James Paice | 443 c1392-3 (Link to this contribution) If the hon. Member for Cleethorpes (Shona McIsaac) were to force a division on the amendment, there ...
James Paice | 443 c1393-7 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry, but with respect the hon. Lady has had a good crack of the whip. [Interruption.] They ar...
David Drew | 443 c1397-8 (Link to this contribution) : The hour is getting late, so I shall be brief. I shall speak to new clause 10, which is tabled by ...
Peter Luff | 443 c1398 (Link to this contribution) We are actually talking about only one circus that uses wild animals—the Great British Circus. The h...
David Drew | 443 c1398 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman is right, but I was not talking about new clause 10; I was trying to tease out fr...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1405 (Link to this contribution) I have been listening carefully to what the Minister has said following his statement to the House. ...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1404-5 (Link to this contribution) I will not give way, because I have very little time left. From our proceedings in Committee and to...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1403-4 (Link to this contribution) I appreciate the hon. Gentleman’s concern, but I repeat that this is the Animal Welfare Bill, which ...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1406-7 (Link to this contribution) Because it is best to leave that up to the discretion of the courts. On amendment No. 108, I unders...
Justine Greening | 443 c1407 (Link to this contribution) Does the Minister agree that a 13-week maximum custodial sentence for the worst cases of animal crue...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1405 (Link to this contribution) I have already addressed static circuses. As I said in Committee, when we consider time scales, we w...
Norman Baker | 443 c1405-6 (Link to this contribution) Just as the Minister successfully constructed a list of tightly drawn exemptions for tail docking, w...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1407-8 (Link to this contribution) As we discussed in Committee, it is not strictly the case that the penalty would be a maximum of 13 ...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1408 (Link to this contribution) As I said to the hon. Gentleman in Committee, we intend the Bill to improve the welfare of greyhound...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1408 (Link to this contribution) I therefore urge the hon. Gentleman to withdraw the motion.
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1408 (Link to this contribution) I thank the Under-Secretary for giving me the opportunity but I was hoping for a longer opportunity ...
David Heath | 443 c1409 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman confirm what the hon. Member for South-East Cambridgeshire (Mr. Paice) said ...
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1409 (Link to this contribution) I am very disappointed by the Government’s response. There is a genuine opportunity for the House to...
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1409 (Link to this contribution) The fact is that there are people who trade in animals on the internet legally, although I would hop...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1409 (Link to this contribution) I apologise to the hon. Gentleman. I repeat that the trade in endangered species has absolutely noth...
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1409-10 (Link to this contribution) The Minister’s complacency is astonishing. The fact is that there have been only two prosecutions un...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1410 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend mentioned missed opportunities. Animal welfare Bills come along only once every 100 y...
David Drew | 443 c1424 (Link to this contribution) I agree. I took part in the pre-legislative scrutiny of the Bill as well as serving on the Standing ...
David Drew | 443 c1423 (Link to this contribution) I, too, express praise for my hon. Friend the Minister. He certainly listened and went further than ...
David Leslie Taylor | 443 c1423-4 (Link to this contribution) : My hon. Friend lists some of the unresolved matters, but as a fellow member of the Select Committe...
Bill Wiggin | 443 c1422-3 (Link to this contribution) The Bill has been four years in the making and I have followed it closely since the beginning. I was...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1426 (Link to this contribution) I, too, congratulate the Minister on the Bill’s passage through the House. I very much enjoyed servi...
Derek Conway | 443 c1425-6 (Link to this contribution) The hour is late and I shall be brief. The House has been genuinely congratulatory of the Minister, ...
Norman Baker | 443 c1424-5 (Link to this contribution) On grounds of accountability and democracy, I encourage the hon. Lady to make her comments in public...
Anne Snelgrove | 443 c1424 (Link to this contribution) Labour Back Benchers always make constructive comments; we do not necessarily make them in public.
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1427 (Link to this contribution) Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker. I am genuinely pleased that the Government have introduced a Bill on...
Norman Baker | 443 c1427 (Link to this contribution) I wish to be helpful to the hon. Gentleman, so can he explain how clause 8, which deals with the dut...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1427 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for the hon. Gentleman’s suggestion, and I believe that clause 8 would be helpful. In ...
Peter Bone | 443 c1427 (Link to this contribution) It is a pleasure to follow my hon. Friend the Member for Kettering (Mr. Hollobone), with whom I very...
Speaker | 443 c1426 (Link to this contribution) Order. I hate to intrude on the benign atmosphere on Third Reading, but I am bound to remind hon. Me...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1426 (Link to this contribution) As always, I am grateful for your advice, Mr. Deputy Speaker. It is extraordinarily difficult in the...
Speaker | 443 c1426 (Link to this contribution) Order. I always want to be helpful, particularly to new Members, so may I suggest the device of an A...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1343-4 (Link to this contribution) I did have sympathy with what the hon. Gentleman said about cephalopods, but I thought that includin...
Paddy Tipping | 443 c1350-1 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend the Member for Cleethorpes (Shona McIsaac), who is a good friend of mine and normally...
Norman Baker | 443 c1398-400 (Link to this contribution) It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Stroud (Mr. Drew). I assure him that I have not been ...
Mark Pritchard | 443 c1410 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes some valid points indeed, and I know that Labour Members will want to seize thi...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1422 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That the Bill be now read the Third time. The hour is late, we have discussed many w...
Ben Bradshaw | 443 c1334 (Link to this contribution) I do not rule that out, because the Bill still has to proceed to another place. If it will reassure ...
Mark Harper | 443 c1361 (Link to this contribution) The Minister gave clear assurances to my hon. Friend the Member for Leominster (Bill Wiggin). If the...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1345-6 (Link to this contribution) I agree. The exemptions would create a massive loophole, which the unscrupulous will abuse. The pain...
Shona McIsaac | 443 c1389 (Link to this contribution) I shall give way first to the hon. Gentleman, and then to the right hon. Lady.
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1408 (Link to this contribution) : I am grateful to the Under-Secretary for his generosity, which is much appreciated. However, the S...
Norman Baker | 443 c1424 (Link to this contribution) I thank all members of the Committee and the Minister for his constructive approach to the Bill. At ...
Eric Martlew | 443 c1345 (Link to this contribution) Our objection to the new clause is that it will be abused. No dog nowadays should have its tail dock...

Subjects

Animal welfare
Abuse
Circuses
Licensing
Dogs
Exemptions
Domestic animals
Internet
Nature conservation
Registration
Sales
Improvement notices

Legislation

Animal Welfare Bill 2005-06

Link

View this Parliamentary proceeding on www.publications.parliament.uk
Back to top