UK Parliament / Open data

Private International Law (Implementation of Agreements) Bill [HL]

Committee of the Whole House (HL) and Debate on bills on Wednesday, 13 May 2020, in the House of Lords.
Lords committee stage first day. Clauses 1 to 3 agreed to on question.

About these Parliamentary proceedings

Reference

803 cc709-770 

Session

2019-21

Department

Ministry of Justice

Legislative stage

Committee stage

Chamber / Committee

House of Lords chamber
Private International Law (Implementation of Agreements) Bill (HL) 2019-21.
Thursday, 27 February 2020
Bills
House of Lords
Delegated Powers and Regulatory Reform Committee eighth report
Wednesday, 18 March 2020
Parliamentary committees
House of Lords
Delegated Powers and Regulatory Reform Committee eleventh report.
Tuesday, 21 April 2020
Parliamentary committees
House of Lords

Proceeding contributions

Lord Faulkner of Worcester | 803 cc709-710 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, this Virtual Committee will now begin. I remind Members that these proceedings are subj...

Lord Faulkner of Worcester | 803 c710 (Link to this contribution)

We now come to the group beginning with Amendment 1. I remind noble Lords that anyone wishing to ...


Show all contributions (110)
Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 803 c710 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Falconer of Thoroton

1: Clause 2, page 2, line 27, leave out subsection...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 803 cc710-2 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the effect of the three amendments in this group—Amendments 1, 4 and 5—is that the powe...

Lord Pannick | 803 cc712-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support the observations so powerfully made by the noble and learned Lord, Lord Falco...

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 803 cc713-4 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am sympathetic to the context set out so eloquently by the noble and learned Lord, Lo...

Lord Faulkner of Worcester | 803 c714 (Link to this contribution)

It may help the noble Baroness if I answer the procedural question she put at the beginning of he...

Lord Anderson of Ipswich | 803 cc714-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, as I understand it, the amendments in this group have two aims: to curb the overbroad p...

Lord Adonis | 803 c715 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the arguments put forward by my noble and learned friend Lord Falconer seem utterly com...

Lord Mance | 803 cc715-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support the observations of the noble and learned Lord, Lord Falconer, and of the nob...

Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 803 cc718-720 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have added my name to the objection to Clause 2 standing part of the Bill, to be move...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 c720 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I thank all noble Lords for their contributions to the debate. I shall of course speak ...

Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall | 803 c720 (Link to this contribution)

We appear to have lost the noble and learned Lord the Minister. Is he still with us?

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 cc720-4 (Link to this contribution)

I think that I am coming back. I apologise, but something happened on the computer.

We have...

Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall | 803 c723 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the following noble Lords indicated a wish to speak after the Minister: the noble Lord,...

Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 803 cc723-5 (Link to this contribution)

I had not intended to intervene at this stage. However, since this, is or ought to be, very simil...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 c725 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I of course am listening to the contributions made to the debate in Committee and will ...

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 803 c725 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I thank my noble and learned friend for his full answer to the concerns that were raise...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 c725 (Link to this contribution)

First, let me make it clear that I do not accept that it is an invariable constitutional practice...

Lord Mance | 803 c726 (Link to this contribution)

I have just a few points to raise with the Minister. At one point, he said that the first amendme...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 cc726-7 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the noble and learned Lord, Lord Mance, for his further observations. I simply notice thi...

Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall | 803 c727 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, before I call the noble Lord, Lord Marks, I should say that the noble Lords, Lord Adoni...

Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 803 c727 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I was not suggesting—and neither, I believe, was the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh—that...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 c727 (Link to this contribution)

On that point, of course I accept that Lugano does not go as far as Brussels Ia and IIa—Brussels ...

Lord Adonis | 803 c727 (Link to this contribution)

I took the Minister’s response to my noble friend Lord Foulkes to mean that he did not recognise ...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 c727 (Link to this contribution)

I mentioned them earlier in my observations with regard to the 1920 and 1933 Acts, which, by Orde...

Lord Pannick | 803 c728 (Link to this contribution)

An important part of the Minister’s argument is that an affirmative procedure suffices because al...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 c728 (Link to this contribution)

There may of course be incidental policy issues that arise when we come to draw down into domesti...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 803 cc728-730 (Link to this contribution)

This very interesting debate has raised, in effect, two substantial questions: as a matter of pri...

Baroness Finlay of Llandaff | 803 c729 (Link to this contribution)

We now come to the group beginning with Amendment 2. I remind noble Lords that anyone wishing to ...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 803 c729 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Falconer of Thoroton

2: Clause 2, page 2, line 29, leave out “relating ...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 803 cc729-731 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I shall try to deal with this group very quickly. It illustrates the width and uncertai...

Lord Anderson of Ipswich | 803 cc731-2 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, those of us who are less than happy with Clause 2 have three options: restricting it to...

Lord Morris of Aberavon | 803 cc732-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am indebted to the noble Lord, Lord Rowlands, for drawing my attention to the impress...

Baroness Finlay of Llandaff | 803 c733 (Link to this contribution)

I believe that the noble Lord, Lord Adonis, does not wish to contribute at this point. I therefor...

Lord Mance | 803 cc733-4 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, as has been pointed out, these amendments illustrate the width of the delegated power p...

Baroness Finlay of Llandaff | 803 c734 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, for information, Amendment 3 is in the next group of amendments. In this group we have ...

Lord Mance | 803 cc734-5 (Link to this contribution)

Yes, it is very helpful. Have I started addressing Amendment 3 by mistake? I certainly did not in...

Lord Thomas of Gresford | 803 cc735-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, in his letter of 19 April in response to the report of the Delegated Powers Committee, ...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 cc736-741 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I begin with Amendment 2, which as the noble and learned Lord, Lord Falconer, noted, wo...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 803 c741 (Link to this contribution)

The extraordinary tedium of that answer should not detract from the enormity of what the Minister...

Baroness Scott of Bybrook | 803 cc741-2 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I think it timely that we should now adjourn until 5.15 pm. That means that broadcastin...

Lord McNicol of West Kilbride | 803 c742 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the Virtual Committee will now resume. We come to the group beginning with Amendment 3....

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 803 c742 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Falconer of Thoroton

3: Clause 2, page 2, line 31, leave out subsection...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 803 c742 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, we have adumbrated many of the same points over and over, because they keep coming up a...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 803 cc742-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I will make two preliminary points. The first echoes what has been said in many of our ...

Lord Adonis | 803 c743 (Link to this contribution)

I have nothing to add to this discussion.

Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 803 c743 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the question raised by my noble and learned friend Lord Wallace of Tankerness is about ...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 cc743-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, as with the previous groups of amendments, the underlying theme is that Clause 2 should...

Lord McNicol of West Kilbride | 803 c744 (Link to this contribution)

One speaker has indicated that they wish to come in on the amendment.

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 803 c744 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I note what the Minister said about fears that something might be imposed on Scotland o...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 c744 (Link to this contribution)

Let me be clear: I do not accept the underlying premise of the noble and learned Lord’s argument....

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 803 c744 (Link to this contribution)

The Minister remorselessly misses the point over a period of time. The purpose of the amendment i...

Lord McNicol of West Kilbride | 803 c744 (Link to this contribution)

We now come to the group beginning with Amendment 7. I remind noble Lords that anyone wishing to ...

Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 803 c744 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

7: Clause 2, page 3, line 14, leave out sub-paragrap...

Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 803 c746 (Link to this contribution)

It is appropriate that these amendments follow those we have just been discussing, 3 and 18. I am...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 803 cc746-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, as the noble Lord, Lord Foulkes of Cumnock, has said, it is welcome that we have this o...

Lord Hope of Craighead | 803 cc748-9 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Foulkes, explained in his introduction that these are probing amen...

Lord Adonis | 803 c749 (Link to this contribution)

I have nothing to add on this group.

Lord Thomas of Gresford | 803 c749 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am of course speaking as a Welshman. We have a very limited interest in the provision...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 803 c749 (Link to this contribution)

I simply underline the points made by my noble friend Lord Foulkes and the noble and learned Lord...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 cc750-1 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am obliged to the noble Lord, Lord Foulkes of Cumnock, for tabling what he very candi...

Lord McNicol of West Kilbride | 803 c751 (Link to this contribution)

As no further speakers have indicated that they wish to intervene on this amendment, I call Lord ...

Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 803 cc751-2 (Link to this contribution)

I apologise for jumping in a little prematurely.

This has been a very useful debate and the...

Lord McNicol of West Kilbride | 803 c752 (Link to this contribution)

We now come to the group beginning with Amendment 14. I remind noble Lords that anyone wishing to...

Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 803 c752 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

14: Clause 2, page 3, line 39, leave out paragraphs ...

Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 803 cc752-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, this brings me to another of my special interests, and one that I have been pursuing fo...

Lord Thomas of Gresford | 803 c753 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have nothing to add to the points succinctly made by the noble Lord, Lord Foulkes.

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 cc753-4 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for what I understand are, again, probing amendments. As I perha...

Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall | 803 c754 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am not aware that any other noble Lords have expressed a wish to speak after the Mini...

Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 803 c754 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am really very grateful to the Minister for a helpful reply; he has dealt with each o...

Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall | 803 c755 (Link to this contribution)

I remind noble Lords that anyone wishing to speak after the Minister should email the clerk durin...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 803 cc1259-1266 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I believe that Clause 2 should not stand part of the Bill. We have discussed these matt...

Lord Pannick | 803 cc1266-756 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I agree with the observations of the noble and learned Lord, Lord Falconer of Thoroton....

Baroness Taylor of Bolton | 803 cc756-7 (Link to this contribution)

I am in a slightly different position from many noble Lords because I joined this Committee sitti...

Lord Judge | 803 c757 (Link to this contribution)

During the rehearsal for this afternoon, I was asked to say my piece, and I used two words. I sai...

Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall | 803 c1278 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the Committee is having some problem in hearing the noble and learned Lord, Lord Judge,...

Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall | 803 c1281 (Link to this contribution)

Perhaps start again, or perhaps go at least two sentences back.

Lord Judge | 803 c1282 (Link to this contribution)

I will try again. On Henry VIII, I was trying to convey that the Bill unnecessarily invests exces...

Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall | 803 c1285 (Link to this contribution)

Lord Judge, I am afraid that there is a problem with your connection. I suggest that we move to t...

Lord Goldsmith | 803 cc1286-759 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I was looking forward to hearing the noble and learned Lord, Lord Judge, and saying tha...

Baroness Jones of Moulsecoomb | 803 cc758-1291 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, like the noble Baroness, Lady Taylor, and the noble Lord, Lord Foulkes, I am not a lawy...

Lord Thomas of Gresford | 803 cc1291-760 (Link to this contribution)

Two questions arise when laws are made by secondary legislation: is there democratic legitimacy a...

Lord Howarth of Newport | 803 cc760-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I agree that Clause 2 should not stand part of the Bill. Under our normal procedure for...

Lord Hope of Craighead | 803 cc761-1300 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, this matter has been so fully covered by the speeches already made that I have little t...

Lord Adonis | 803 cc1301-764 (Link to this contribution)

It is very clear that the Committee is overwhelmingly against the Government on Clause 2, althoug...

Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall | 803 c764 (Link to this contribution)

: My Lords, I am hoping to call the noble and learned Lord, Lord Morris of Aberavon, in a second,...

Lord Judge | 803 c765 (Link to this contribution)

Good. Do you mind if I ask whether you heard anything that I said when I started last time?

Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall | 803 c1303 (Link to this contribution)

In the interest of making sure that everybody hears everything that the noble and learned Lord ha...

Lord Judge | 803 c1303 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the Deputy Chairman very much. I apologise to those who have already heard me say this bu...

Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall | 803 c766 (Link to this contribution)

We were very glad to have your contribution.

Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 803 cc766-7 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, for some years I had the privilege of serving on the Delegated Powers and Regulatory Re...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 cc767-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I thank noble Lords and noble and learned Lords for their contribution to this part of ...

Earl of Devon | 803 cc768-9 (Link to this contribution)

I understood that I would get an opportunity to speak before the Minister rather than after him, ...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 c769 (Link to this contribution)

As regards the UK-US negotiations, I say only that I am not in a position to comment on how far t...

Lord Adonis | 803 cc1308-1311 (Link to this contribution)

Perhaps I may add to my earlier contribution to the Committee, since it looks as if we will vote ...

Lord Keen of Elie | 803 c770 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Adonis, has made a number of extremely telling and important point...

Baroness Finlay of Llandaff | 803 c1312 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I shall now put the question that Clause 2 stand part of the Bill; all microphones will...

Baroness Finlay of Llandaff | 803 c1317 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, it takes unanimity to amend the Bill. If a single voice says “Content”, the clause stan...

Baroness Scott of Bybrook | 803 c1319 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, this may be a convenient moment for the Virtual Committee to adjourn.

Baroness Finlay of Llandaff | 803 c1319 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the Virtual Committee stands adjourned.

7.12 pm

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