Customs and Borders

My hon. Friend is right: there are so many unanswered questions and the clock really is ticking. ...

Does the right hon. Lady accept, though, that even with a customs union there would still be a ne...

The hon. Gentleman is exactly right. There are wider regulatory issues that need to be addressed....

The Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders announced today that there has been a 14% drop in ...

My hon. Friend is exactly right, because the lack of certainty makes it extremely difficult for a...

In the right hon. Lady’s contacts with business, has she come across any businesses that are curr...

Funnily enough, I have not, and I doubt that many of us have either, because for those employers—...

Businesses in my constituency of Colne Valley, like others across the country, are deeply concern...

I do agree with that and it is, interestingly, the view of both the CBI and the TUC that a custom...

Can the right hon. Lady explain how it is that we have such a smooth-running, fast-growing and ve...

I think the right hon. Gentleman is simply making the point that our trade was growing, within th...

Would it not also be the case that, as a country that champions free trade, we have seen the redu...

The right hon. Lady is exactly right. Where we currently have good free trading arrangements we s...

In answer to the right hon. Member for Wokingham (John Redwood), I am struggling to think of a co...

Unfortunately, I did not catch the beginning of the hon. Gentleman’s intervention. May I ask him ...

In answer to the right hon. Gentleman, I am struggling to think of a trading partner that we have...

The hon. Gentleman is exactly right. Not only that, but those other countries that we might seek ...

The European Union is a customs union. The right hon. Lady has spoken of preserving our existing ...

Obviously, the customs union is a part of the European Union; that is the arrangement that is in ...

My right hon. Friend mentioned trade through ports. She is aware that my constituency is on the f...

They are, and it is perhaps unsurprising that they should do so, because businesses will make inv...

Does my right hon. Friend agree that the biggest threat of all is the threat to jobs, as business...

I do, and I think this is also particularly about our manufacturing communities, and many of our ...

rose—

I will give way to the hon. Gentleman, and then I want to make progress, as a lot of Members want...

I am grateful. The right hon. Lady has been very generous in taking interventions. Earlier, she r...

Look, there will be some for whom this debate is partly about what happened in the referendum. Ot...

I am really pleased that the right hon. Lady secured this debate. The point she is making about t...

That is right. If a manufacturer’s components come in from China but then, as part of the manufac...

My right hon. Friend will be aware that third countries represent some 12% of our exports via the...

That is right. I think there is common agreement that we want no tariffs with the EU as part of t...

My right hon. Friend has mentioned that businesses are very concerned about this issue. I met ove...

That goes to the heart of the situation. It is partly about certainty and partly about knowing th...

My hon. Friend is being very generous in giving way. Unite––the union shop stewards who came to v...

That is right. Many of these manufacturing towns and areas may well have voted to leave the Europ...

I thank my right hon. Friend for giving way; she has been very generous. If she wants to unite th...

A customs union should be at the heart of that free trade agreement. Whatever the trading or futu...

My right hon. Friend is right when she says that small towns such as the ones that I represent—Bo...

That is exactly right. They want a Brexit deal that is good for manufacturing, and to be honest, ...

To go back to the question that the hon. Member for Vauxhall (Kate Hoey) asked, any free trade ag...

The right hon. and learned Gentleman is right: in the end, any agreement has obligations attached...

Will the right hon. Lady give way?

I will make this one of the final interventions. I want to deal with the objections that people h...

I am very grateful. To build on the point that the right hon. and learned Member for Beaconsfield...

There is no doubt about that. If we have no customs union, there will be less free trade than we ...

Will the right hon. Lady take a moment to reflect on the statement that the Prime Minister made y...

I have huge respect for the hon. Lady’s views on this, and I agree. We have to show some responsi...

Will the right hon. Lady give way?

May I make some progress first?

Three specific objections to a customs union tend to be pre...

Would that not also be in breach of World Trade Organisation rules? It would require exemption in...

The hon. Lady is right. It raises huge questions about the rule of law, about the system would be...

I am listening closely to what the right hon. Lady is saying, but there are already cameras for n...

The right hon. Gentleman will be aware that the concern relates to what happens around the border...

When the Exiting the European Union Committee visited South Armagh a couple of months ago, everyo...

It is significant that the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee concluded last month that there wer...

The Northern Ireland shadow team, of which I am a member, paid a visit to Stormont. We met the le...

I completely agree; I think that that is immensely important. It brings me back to what I said ab...

When members of the Treasury Committee were in the United States, we were told one thing consiste...

The hon. Gentleman is right. Other Members will have more evidence and experience than I when it ...

I thank my right hon. Friend for giving way; she is being very generous. Analysis by the Cardiff ...

My hon. Friend is exactly right. This is affecting businesses all over the country.

I want ...

Will my right hon. Friend give way?

I will not, because I am conscious of time.

We did not do this simply to create a new Depar...

Order. Neither the right hon. and learned Member for Rushcliffe (Mr Clarke) nor the hon. Member f...

I will strive to do my best, Mr Speaker.

May I begin by congratulating the right hon. Membe...

rose—

I will give way in just a second. There are no advantages in introducing tariffs to European trad...

I am grateful to the Father of the House for giving way. He has served in this House for 48 years...

Not deliberately—but accidentally, several times. [Laughter.] The hon. Gentleman makes reference ...

Will the right hon. and learned Gentleman give way?

I will give way, after which I will go back to the question of trade relations with non-EU countr...

On a recent visit to Norway with the Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy Committee, we heard...

I quite agree. The Norwegians have a second-best solution by a good long way. When I was Chancell...

Will my right hon. and learned Friend give way?

With great respect to my close ally and friend, I must make a little progress and finish making t...

Will the right hon. and learned Gentleman give way?

I really should not, because the Speaker will get extremely annoyed. I must come to a quick concl...

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. I apologise for interrupting this important debate on a topic on...

I am very grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his point of order. The short answer is no. I have b...

Mr Speaker, I very much think that I will not need to take cognisance of your allowing me longer ...

Will the hon. Lady give way?

I will give way to the right hon. and learned Gentleman, but then I will not give way an awful lo...

The hon. Lady does not normally use a European debate to make the allegation that this is just a ...

My point, of course, is that if we were to stay in the customs union, that would be seen as a tra...

I am listening carefully to the hon. Lady but, with respect, she is rehearsing familiar arguments...

The hon. Gentleman might remember that not a single person who has spoken so far has even mention...

We spend a lot of time in this Chamber developing new regulations and rules that put costs on bus...

There is an issue there, but it is something that we can solve through negotiation and discussion...

Will my hon. Friend give way?

I will not. Well, I had better give way to one Member from my own side.

Businesses in my constituency have expressed huge concern that, when we leave the EU, we will cea...

The problem with our staying inside a customs union is that we would then be subject to the decis...

Will the hon. Lady give way again?

Oh, all right.

I will not intervene again, I promise. It is very courteous of the hon. Lady to give way.

L...

The right hon. and learned Member and other Members have said that, and we have to make a lot of ...

Will my hon. Friend give way on that point?

No, I will not give way to my hon. Friend.

I should like to move on to the issue of the bor...

I am grateful to the hon. Lady for allowing me to intervene. I can assure her that I do not forge...

Of course Sinn Féin would love a border poll, but as the hon. Lady knows, there are regulations a...

At the recent meeting of the Brexit Committee in Northern Ireland, the Deputy Chief Constable sai...

No, he was not at all. The problem is that people think of a hard border as big cameras, lights, ...

Will the hon. Lady give way?

Will the hon. Lady give way?

No.

I believe that the EU is using the border to try to change our policy. It is obviously ...

Order. A five-minute limit on each Back-Bench speech will now apply.

1.51 pm

It is a pleasure to follow three such excellent speeches, two of which I agreed with and one that...

I utterly agree with everything that my right hon. Friend has just said. I joined a free-trading ...

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The cost to business, as identified already by my hon. Friend...

rose—

I give way to the former Trade Minister.

Just on a small technical point, my right hon. Friend is absolutely right that a trade deal takes...

I understand the point my hon. Friend has made; he is a former Minister and everything else. I wi...

I am glad to be able to speak in this debate, which was secured by my right hon. Friend the Membe...

Will the hon. Lady give way?

I will not, unfortunately, because of the pressure of time.

You will get an extra minute.

Yes, all right, I will give way.

The hon. Lady makes a very important point about the linkage between goods and services. A custom...

The hon. Gentleman makes an extremely important point and, indeed, takes my argument further. I t...

I join all those who have spoken today, other than the hon. Member for Vauxhall (Kate Hoey), and ...

As a member of the Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy Committee, I met some pharmaceutical ...

The hon. Gentleman speaks with authority because he knows the reality. He will also know that pha...

Is my right hon. Friend therefore proposing that we stay members not just of the customs union, b...

I absolutely am. I made it very clear to my constituents when I stood for re-election in Broxtowe...

I will focus my remarks on the work of the Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy Committee reg...

Is my hon. Friend aware that the members of the International Trade Committee made a similar find...

Yes. Of course, this is most keenly felt and apparent along the border between Northern Ireland a...

To reinforce the hon. Lady’s point that her findings apply everywhere, is she aware that the repo...

The hon. Gentleman and I have a long history, as we fought the Bromley and Chislehurst by-electio...

Will my hon. Friend give way?

I will just make a little bit of progress.

Diageo uses 11% of Ireland’s cream output every ...

I am delighted that this debate has been extended to 5 o’clock, but I am afraid that my duties as...

Many of my constituents say to me that they voted to join a common market. If there were a compro...

I would like to agree with my hon. Friend, in the sense that if the European Union were to offer ...

Rubbish!

My right hon. Friend proclaims, “Rubbish!”, from a sedentary position. I think he knows me well e...

rose—

I give way to my right hon. Friend, who—

Order. Before the right hon. Lady intervenes, can I make this point? People are perfectly entitle...

No.

I was about to say that my right hon. Friend is talked of frequently in my constituency. I say th...

Will my hon. Friend give way?

No, because I will upset Mr Speaker, who has already been very kind.

If we are to respect t...

Two great problems have plagued Governments in this place for over 200 years —the Irish question ...

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

I will give way once.

I am very grateful. Does the hon. Gentleman agree that generations to come may well look back at ...

As I said in an intervention, I have recently been to South Armagh with the Select Committee. I c...

As we head towards our departure from the European Union in just under a year, I believe that our...

I fully associate myself with the remarks of my right hon. Friend the Member for Normanton, Ponte...

Has my hon. Friend’s Committee looked at the cost and number of officials we will need at the bor...

My hon. Friend raises an important point. In another report, published last December, we looked a...

I see that a Treasury Minister is responding to this debate, not a Trade Minister. This is a new ...

In Mid Norfolk, where my constituents voted to leave, the majority opinion on the doorstep was: “...

That is absolutely right. My right hon. Friend the Member for West Dorset (Sir Oliver Letwin), in...

I have sat and listened to some expert speakers this afternoon. As a Member who was elected only ...

My hon. Friend is making excellent points. Is she also worried about the impact on inward investm...

Absolutely. My hon. Friend makes an excellent point, and global companies in my constituency say ...

On Monday, Michel Barnier laid bare for all to see what staying in the customs union would mean f...

Will my hon. Friend give way?

I will not give way because other Members wish to speak. I am really sorry.

The worst of al...

To me, this debate means more than just customs and borders; it means jobs and investment in my c...

indicated dissent.

It is slightly different, but it needs arbitration—

rose—

I will take one intervention—from the hon. Gentleman.

I am very glad that the hon. Gentleman makes that point. My constituency voted to remain by 521 v...

I am grateful for that intervention. I am making the point that the customs union replicates the ...

I have a confession to make: when I voted in the 2016 referendum, I did not spend a great deal of...

It is Cornwall, not Somerset.

I apologise to my hon. Friend the Member for South East Cornwall (Mrs Murray)—I am corrected.

Does my hon. Friend share my concern that so many Members do not even know what the customs union...

I am grateful for my right hon. Friend’s intervention.

Let me explain why the customs union...

I am delighted to follow the hon. Member for Eddisbury (Antoinette Sandbach).

I agree with ...

I agree wholeheartedly with my hon. Friend. Is she as alarmed as I am that those projections woul...

It does not bear thinking about. I and my hon. Friend are not alone in our concerns. Last July, w...

Order.

3.19 pm

As a remainer and a democrat, I must respect the result of the referendum. Membership of the cust...

I begin by thanking my right hon. Friend the Member for Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford (Yve...

Does the hon. Gentleman agree that the Brexiteers’ claim that we have to leave the customs union ...

It is frankly arrant nonsense to suggest that staying within the EU or being in the customs union...

Order.

3.30 pm

I am a firm supporter of the Prime Minister’s position on this question, and I will set out why.<...

My intention would not be to enter a Turkish-style agreement, and the EU has already conceded tha...

In essence, not having a veto is not having control on the outcome. An agreement would be negotia...

Has the hon. Gentleman considered that Turkey might be staying in the customs union for economic ...

I do not believe that it is to our economic advantage. Turkey has long prized EU membership as a ...

How does my hon. Friend imagine that he can engage in this regulatory divergence without incurrin...

We are precisely seeking an ambitious free trade agreement both with Europe and with the rest of ...

Dreamland.

It is certainly not dreamland. If my hon. Friend reads the compelling paper written by my hon. Fr...

Resisting a customs union and the single market without a mandate from the voters, which we have ...

Order.

3.43 pm

It is a pleasure to participate in this debate, but I do not want to repeat what was said by the ...

It is a pleasure to follow the right hon. and learned Member for Beaconsfield (Mr Grieve). I comm...

Outside an effective customs union there is no such thing as a frictionless border. There is no e...

Speaking as a member of the hon. Lady’s Committee, can I ask her to confirm that every single wit...

I thank the right hon. Gentleman; I can confirm that.

There are other very worrying example...

It is a pleasure to follow—

Order. I am sorry—I should have formally announced a four-minute limit. It is in effect but I sho...

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Totnes (Dr Wollaston)...

I agree with everything my right hon. Friend is saying. Does he share my complete confusion that ...

Absolutely, and I will come on to that very strong point shortly. The chaos those people have cau...

It is quite daunting to speak in a debate in which there have been so many knowledgeable and lear...

Does the hon. Gentleman not accept that outside the customs unions we are a small market, but tha...

I disagree. We are the fifth-largest economy in the world and, unlike the hon. Lady, I passionate...

My mother, who reaches a milestone birthday today, has taught me many things in life, including w...

In my constituency, 4,000 jobs—16% of the total employment—are in manufacturing. Does my hon. Fri...

I emphasise that if there are further interventions, which are legitimate in parliamentary terms,...

I completely agree with my hon. Friend. Our car industry imports 60% of its components, so a Brit...

Happy birthday to Mummy Creasy.

4.11 pm

It is a pleasure to speak in this important debate. Our trading arrangements are of great importa...

Order. After the next speaker the time limit will have to be reduced to three minutes.

4.15...

I welcome this debate and I support all the excellent points raised by those who, like me, suppor...

Order. A three-minute limit now applies.

4.19 pm

I voted remain and campaigned heavily to remain. I held eight debates during that campaign, along...

I have previously severely criticised Parliament’s inaction as seen in its failure to properly sc...

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

The hon. Gentleman knows perfectly well that I do not have time to take interventions.

A lo...

In her Mansion House speech, the Prime Minister set out five tests for the EU negotiations and th...

Mr Speaker, I would like to take this opportunity to be the first person in this place to congrat...

I thank my right hon. Friend the Member for Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford (Yvette Cooper) ...

Order. The winding-up speeches of up to eight minutes each will begin now.

4.34 pm

I congratulate the right hon. Member for Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford (Yvette Cooper) on ...

The debate has been enlightening and I have welcomed the chance to listen to all the Members acro...

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

I would like to, but I do not have the time.

Clause 31 of the Taxation (Cross-border Trade)...

I congratulate the right hon. Member for Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford (Yvette Cooper) on ...

Will the Minister give way?

I give way to my hon. Friend.

Thank you. It is nice that the Minister regards me as an hon. Friend.

I gently say to the M...

The position of the Prime Minister and the Government is that we are confident of a deal. In that...

Does the Financial Secretary believe the trade agreements we negotiate could possibly be better t...

As the hon. Lady knows, we are currently working on transferring the EU’s agreements with third-w...

Now that the Minister has been un-shelled—he is doing very well—could he name one trade deal and ...

An ingenious question; I would expect no less. As my hon. Friend will know, we are not able to en...

This has been an excellent debate. We have had substantial speeches drawing on huge evidence and ...

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. Now that the House has resolved to call on the Government to inc...

I am not certain that I am in a position to confirm anything today. What I would say to the hon. ...