UK Parliament / Open data

Political Parties and Elections Bill

Debate on bills on Monday, 15 June 2009, in the House of Lords.
Political Parties and Elections Bill. Report stage first day.

About these Parliamentary proceedings

Reference

711 c844-53,867-922,935-42 

Session

2008-09

Department

Ministry of Justice

Legislative stage

Report stage

Procedure

Government defeats
New clauses

Chamber / Committee

House of Lords chamber

Related items

Political Parties and Elections Bill. As amended in Grand Committee.
Wednesday, 13 May 2009
Bills
House of Lords
Political Parties, Elections and Referendums Act 2000
Thursday, 30 November 2000
Public acts

Proceeding contributions

Lord Bates | 711 c873 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we already have a problem, and I am sure that the noble Lord, as a student of matters proc...
Lord Bach | 711 c874-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for raising this topic. The amendment would compel the Secretary of...

Show all contributions (123)
Lord Tyler | 711 c875-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to all Members of your Lordships’ House who have contributed to this thought...
Lord Tyler | 711 c869-70 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not think that the noble Lord has been following my argument. We will have, as we are...
Lord Borrie | 711 c870 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not know whether I misheard the noble Lord, Lord Tyler, but I think he said something...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 711 c870-1 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have a reservation that the noble Lord might wish to consider. I sat on the Members’ Int...
Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 711 c871-2 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I support the remarks of my noble friend Lord Campbell-Savours. I can see exactly that sor...
Lord Hodgson of Astley Abbotts | 711 c872 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I follow the noble Lord, Lord Borrie, in thinking that much of this amendment seems previo...
Lord Bates | 711 c872-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I must admit that I feel some professional sympathy for the noble Lord, Lord Tyler. His am...
Lord Henley | 711 c883 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I was amused by the Minister’s final remarks. It was almost as if his speaking note, writt...
Lord Brooke of Sutton Mandeville | 711 c883 (Link to this contribution) Clause 6: Number of Electoral Commissioners Amendment 23 23: Clause 6, page 5, line 4, leave out "...
Lord Tyler | 711 c881 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, in Grand Committee my noble friend Lord Rennard expressed some anxiety about this proposit...
Lord Bach | 711 c881-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the amendments both relate to early payment discounts for financial penalties imposed by t...
Lord Henley | 711 c881 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 16 16: Schedule 2, page 51, line 12, leave out "early payment discounts or"
Lord Henley | 711 c881 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I speak also to Amendment 21. These two amendments deal with Schedule 2 and, in particular...
Lord Bach | 711 c879-80 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I start with an apology. I said that I would write to the Committee, giving examples of wh...
Lord Bates | 711 c880-1 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for his response to the amendments and for the additional in...
Lord Bates | 711 c878 (Link to this contribution) Schedule 2: Civil sanctions: Schedule to be inserted into the 2000 Act Amendment 3 3: Schedule 2, ...
Lord Bates | 711 c878-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the amendment is in the name also of my noble friend Lord Henley. The amendments in this g...
Lord Brooke of Sutton Mandeville | 711 c883-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, Amendment 23 requires a brief word of explanation. I raised the issue of the statutory num...
Lord Norton of Louth | 711 c893-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it may be appropriate if I respond to the Minister’s speech in moving the amendment. I ver...
Lord Brooke of Sutton Mandeville | 711 c891 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, in line with the intimation of my opening speech, I found the Minister’s explanation just ...
Lord Tunnicliffe | 711 c891 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 26 26: After Clause 7, insert the following new Clause— "Education about systems of gover...
Lord Tunnicliffe | 711 c891-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I will speak also to government Amendment 123 and it will be useful for me to speak in ant...
Lord Pearson of Rannoch | 711 c893 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, can the noble Lord confirm that Clause 6 of the existing Bill would prevent the recent fia...
Lord Hodgson of Astley Abbotts | 711 c884-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, my Amendment 24 in the group is concerned with political restrictions on staff in Clause 7...
Lord Tyler | 711 c885-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I repeat the point that I made in Committee, to which the noble Lord, Lord Hodgson, has re...
Lord Henley | 711 c886 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, my Amendment 25, which is grouped with Amendment 24, relates purely to the new paragraph 1...
Lord Tunnicliffe | 711 c886-91 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank noble Lords for these amendments. I believe that what I am about to say will cover...
Lord Pearson of Rannoch | 711 c894 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, is it in order for me to ask a question about Amendment 26 as well? If the European Commis...
Lord Tunnicliffe | 711 c894 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am not going to respond to a question in the noble Lord’s second speech as this is Repor...
Lord Pearson of Rannoch | 711 c895 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 28 28: Before Clause 8, insert the following new Clause— "Permissible donors (1) In secti...
Lord Henley | 711 c894 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I agree with my noble friend Lord Norton that we are grateful that the Government have res...
Lord Pearson of Rannoch | 711 c894 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, once again the political establishment has got out of revealing to the British people what...
Lord Henley | 711 c898 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Pearson, takes us back in history to the 2000 Act, whose passage I do...
Lord Neill of Bladen | 711 c897-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I declare an interest in that I was the chairman of the standards committee when it produc...
Lord Anderson of Swansea | 711 c897 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, there may or may not be anomalies in respect of legacies, but I fail to follow the noble L...
Lord Pearson of Rannoch | 711 c895-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, noble Lords may recognise the first part of this amendment as the same which the Conservat...
Lord Bach | 711 c898-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this amendment relates to the permissibility requirements surrounding donations made by in...
Lord Goodhart | 711 c900 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have no objection to the noble Lord using my words. If I said it then, I am sure that I ...
Lord Neill of Bladen | 711 c900 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, perhaps I should point out that I had ceased to be chairman of the committee when it was r...
Lord Pearson of Rannoch | 711 c900 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to all noble Lords who have spoken, including the noble Lord, Lord Anderson,...
Lord Bach | 711 c900 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to both noble Lords. With great respect, we think that the noble Lord, Lord ...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 711 c901-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I shall also speak to Amendment 30. These amendments were debated at great length in Commi...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 711 c900 (Link to this contribution) Clause 8: Declaration as to source of donation Amendment 29 29: Clause 8, page 7, line 14, at end ...
Lord Borrie | 711 c906 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, my noble friend Lord Campbell-Savours has made a powerful case not only on the substance o...
Lord Tyler | 711 c904-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I and my colleagues very strongly support these amendments, as we did in Grand Committee. ...
Lord Williamson of Horton | 711 c906 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I agree with the purpose of the amendment. Over 10 years, I have taken very great care not...
Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 711 c907-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not think the two things go together, with the greatest respect. We will come to the ...
Lord Anderson of Swansea | 711 c908-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, my noble friend recognises that there is a problem and argues that the amendment does not ...
Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 711 c906-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I rise with a little trepidation to put a slightly different point of view. I have great s...
Lord Goodhart | 711 c907 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, might the noble Baroness consider dealing with that point by supporting the amendment tabl...
Lord Rooker | 711 c911 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I did not intend to speak, but I must say that I wholly support the amendment in the name ...
Lord Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay | 711 c910-1 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this is what I mean when I say that we should not accept any donations from companies at a...
Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 711 c910 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am sorry to intervene. The noble Lord has talked about individuals, which seems fine. Th...
Lord Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay | 711 c910 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, briefly, I support this amendment and the excellent speeches made by the noble Lord, Lord ...
Lord Lea of Crondall | 711 c909-10 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it is probably incumbent on members of the Labour group who are inclined to support the am...
Lord Neill of Bladen | 711 c909 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, there are two debates going on. The first is whether the amendment is in substance correct...
Lord Bates | 711 c911-2 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this has been a debate of outstanding quality. I am new to your Lordships’ House, and it i...
Lord Sewel | 711 c912 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord for giving way. I accept that he is making a very balanced...
Lord Bates | 711 c912-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I follow the noble Lord’s argument. There is a sense in which it could be argued that the ...
Lord Warner | 711 c911 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, briefly, I support all those who have spoken in favour of the amendment in the name of my ...
Lord Maclennan of Rogart | 711 c915 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, is it seriously the Government’s intention to suggest that the European Convention on Huma...
Lord Bach | 711 c914-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, Amendments 29 and 30 would add to the permissibility requirements relating to donations fr...
Lord Bates | 711 c913-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, that is genuinely the case. The Liberal Democrat Benches laugh at this, although their ide...
Lord Bach | 711 c915 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, will the noble Lord just hear my argument on this, which I hope will deal with the point t...
Lord Goodhart | 711 c915 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, will all respect to the Minister, that seems to be a highly improbable interpretation of A...
Lord Tunnicliffe | 711 c940 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank both noble Lords for the support that they have given to however many amendments i...
Lord Tyler | 711 c939-40 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I think that we are all grateful not just to the Minister this evening for explaining the ...
Lord Henley | 711 c940 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I, too, am grateful to the Minister for taking so much trouble to explain to the House the...
Lord Tunnicliffe | 711 c935-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, these are technical amendments to Clause 11 on the control of donations to members’ associ...
Lord Tunnicliffe | 711 c935 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 31 not moved. Clause 11: Control of donations to members associations: responsible person...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 711 c922 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 30 30: Clause 8, page 7, line 37, at end insert— "(3A) A declaration under this section m...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 711 c920-1 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, my noble friend had very little to say about the position of the House of Commons—many of ...
Lord Bach | 711 c920 (Link to this contribution) Well, it is important that the Government case is put, my Lords, particularly as this is a matter of...
Lord Bach | 711 c919-20 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, in principle almost anything is perfectly possible. Those of us here whose job it is to pa...
Lord Bach | 711 c918-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am explaining that a very large number of people do not fill in tax returns, but there m...
Lord Lea of Crondall | 711 c919 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I must have misunderstood what the Minister said, and I would be grateful if he would clar...
Lord Bach | 711 c919 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, indeed not. It was suggested that the House of Lords Appointments Commission’s method of p...
Lord Tyler | 711 c919 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, is the Minister saying that, in principle, it is perfectly possible, and that it is just t...
Lord Bach | 711 c915 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am not in a position to be able to answer that.
Lord Bach | 711 c916-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, noble Lords laugh, but that is a little unfair. The advice that we have received from our ...
Lord Anderson of Swansea | 711 c915 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have a simple question. Was that advice based on any authority?
Lord Bach | 711 c915 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the advice that the Government have received on this issue is, I repeat, that there is a r...
Lord Bach | 711 c941 (Link to this contribution) Clause 12: Control of donations to holders of elective office: compliance officers Amendment 34 34...
Lord Bach | 711 c940 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 33 33: Clause 11, page 12, line 4, leave out "A notice under this paragraph" and insert "...
Lord Bach | 711 c941-2 (Link to this contribution) Clause 16: Reports of gifts received by unincorporated associations making donations Amendments 35 ...
Lord Bach | 711 c850 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I think that for once the noble Lord is wrong. I specifically asked outside the Chamber wh...
Lord Tunnicliffe | 711 c851 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, perhaps your Lordships will note that the House is on Report, and that page 122 of the Com...
Baroness Butler-Sloss | 711 c850 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, since 2000, has the Electoral Commission entered premises and investigated without the con...
Lord Bach | 711 c850 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, hard as he tried, the noble Lord could not try my patience. I take the point, but I do not...
Lord Marland | 711 c849-50 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, at the risk of testing the Minister’s patience, I agree with his point about Damian Green ...
Lord Bach | 711 c849 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not blame the noble Lord for using that example, but it is a completely irrelevant an...
Lord Hodgson of Astley Abbotts | 711 c850 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, in the Minister’s explanation of why the Government wish to reject the amendment, he place...
Lord Bach | 711 c850 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it has not happened. It is a back-up power. It has either been successful or not, dependin...
Lord Pearson of Rannoch | 711 c849 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I hope that the noble Lord realises that saying that something is already there and theref...
Lord Bach | 711 c849 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, of course I do not say that because this has been law since 2000, that is a complete answe...
Lord Bates | 711 c849 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the Minister asked what has changed since then. The answer is the incident with Damian Gre...
Lord Neill of Bladen | 711 c846 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I, too, support the amendment. There seems no good reason why we do not have the normal fo...
Lord Ramsbotham | 711 c847 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I too would like to add my strong support to this amendment. In my naivety I did not reali...
Lord Cobbold | 711 c846 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I think it is one of the principal duties of this House to look after the interests of the...
Lord Bach | 711 c847 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am very grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Marlesford, for introducing this short debate o...
Lord Waddington | 711 c847 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have difficulty in understanding why it is necessary to confer this power.
Lord Bach | 711 c847-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, that is probably true, but this is solely to do with the regulatory role as opposed to the...
Lord Marlesford | 711 c844-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I feel that I should apologise to the House for intruding on a Bill in which I have not ta...
Lord Bates | 711 c845-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I support the amendment moved so ably by my noble friend. His intrusion, as he put it, int...
Lord Marlesford | 711 c844 (Link to this contribution) Schedule 1: Investigatory powers of Commission: Schedule to be inserted into the 2000 Act Amendment...
Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 711 c869 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, does the noble Lord not think that it would be difficult to define the difference between ...
Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 711 c868 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, will the noble Lord give way?
Lord Tyler | 711 c868 (Link to this contribution) I have only just started, my Lords, but of course I will.
Lord Tyler | 711 c868-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, your Lordships' House is famous for the ability, often taken, to divert from the subject o...
Lord Bach | 711 c851 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it is all in Schedule 1. This item comes under the sub-heading "Powers of entry and inspec...
Lord Marlesford | 711 c851-2 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for his attempt to explain why my amendment is unnecessary a...
Lord Tyler | 711 c867 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 2 2: After Clause 3, insert the following new Clause— "Review: the procedures for local r...
Lord Goodhart | 711 c918 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, is the Minister suggesting that any of the people who pay solely through PAYE are likely t...
Lord Tunnicliffe | 711 c895 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank noble Lords who participated in the debate. On the first question asked by the nob...
Lord Tyler | 711 c867-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I want to make it clear that the new clause we are proposing fulfils the promises made by ...
Lord Lyell of Markyate | 711 c851 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have one question. The noble Lord, Lord Bach, has been saying repeatedly that this will ...
Lord Neill of Bladen | 711 c847 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, will the Minister deal with this point? All the documents that he has referred to would be...
Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 711 c868 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I should like the noble Lord to clear up a fundamental point. The procedure he is outlinin...

Subjects

Civil proceedings
Finance
Elections
Education
Fixed penalties
Eligibility
Donors
Electoral Commission
European Union
Electoral register
Domicil
Misconduct
Powers of entry
Public appointments
Members
Political parties
Referendums
Politics and government
Staff
Standards
Taxation
Parliamentary Commissioner for Standards
Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority
Compliance officers

Legislation

Political Parties and Elections Bill 2007-08 to 2008-09

Link

View this Parliamentary proceeding on www.publications.parliament.uk
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