UK Parliament / Open data

Political Parties and Elections Bill

Debate on bills and Committee proceeding on Wednesday, 13 May 2009, in the House of Lords.

About these Parliamentary proceedings

Reference

710 c387-454GC 

Session

2008-09

Department

Ministry of Justice

Legislative stage

Committee stage

Procedure

New clauses

Chamber / Committee

House of Lords Grand Committee

Related items

Political Parties and Elections Bill. As amended in Grand Committee.
Wednesday, 13 May 2009
Bills
House of Lords
Political Parties and Elections Bill. Brought from the Commons. Explanatory Notes HL Bill 26-EN also published.
Tuesday, 3 March 2009
Bills
House of Lords

Proceeding contributions

Lord Tyler | 710 c426-7GC (Link to this contribution) That immediately takes me to the next point that the Electoral Commission raised. It is not clear wh...
Lord Tyler | 710 c427GC (Link to this contribution) It is entirely a matter for the candidate whether to explain what their particular job or interest i...

Show all contributions (114)
Lord Neill of Bladen | 710 c407GC (Link to this contribution) How does the noble Lord’s plan deal with death? You have a rolling register to which people add thei...
Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 710 c400-1GC (Link to this contribution) I am distressed to say that I cannot accept a word of what my noble friend said. He knows how much I...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c394-5GC (Link to this contribution) But we do know that there have been no prosecutions in the county of Cumbria and that there are larg...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c392-3GC (Link to this contribution) I am not altogether convinced that we will see an increase in registration as a result of this legis...
Lord Bach | 710 c452GC (Link to this contribution) Amendments 134 and 135 134: Schedule 5, page 59, line 9, leave out "forms, in" and insert "forms— (...
Lord Greaves | 710 c432-3GC (Link to this contribution) Talking about old postal ballots takes me back to our lengthy debates in this room on the European P...
Lord Bach | 710 c433GC (Link to this contribution) I can help the noble Lord on that. As I understand it, regional returning officers for the regions o...
Lord Greaves | 710 c434-5GC (Link to this contribution) That is even better news. I cannot imagine that people in some of the more hard-headed parts of Lanc...
Lord Bach | 710 c436GC (Link to this contribution) I will be able to give some help about regulations in a moment. Regulations made under the Electoral...
Lord Bach | 710 c436-8GC (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the noble Lord. I will take that idea back, if I may. Amendment 131 amends provisi...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c447GC (Link to this contribution) We have 25 minutes left to complete this stage of the Bill. All I can say is that I completely suppo...
Lord Bach | 710 c421-4GC (Link to this contribution) Amendments 125D and 125E 125D: After Clause 21, insert the following new Clause— "Obligatory provis...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c424GC (Link to this contribution) Amendment 127 127: After Clause 23, insert the following new Clause— "Registration of interests by ...
Lord Tyler | 710 c429GC (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord, Lord Campbell-Savours, has just given the game away. Clearly, you only get the job o...
Lord Hamilton of Epsom | 710 c427GC (Link to this contribution) I support the noble Lord, Lord Tyler, on this issue. There is certainly a big reputational problem w...
Lord Henley | 710 c430-1GC (Link to this contribution) I shall speak also to Amendments 129, 131 and 132. I will not be moving Amendment 132AB, which is in...
Lord Tyler | 710 c431GC (Link to this contribution) We have examined carefully the proposals put forward by the noble Lord, Lord Henley, and listened ca...
Lord Tyler | 710 c451-2GC (Link to this contribution) I certainly shall not repeat all the arguments that we had about Clause 17. However, I want to take ...
Lord Bach | 710 c451GC (Link to this contribution) These are minor consequential government amendments required to give effect to Clause 17, which was ...
Lord Bates | 710 c447GC (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord has rehearsed a number of the arguments that were raised in relation to the previous ...
Lord Bach | 710 c451GC (Link to this contribution) Schedule 5: Minor and consequential amendments Amendment 133 133: Schedule 5, page 59, line 2, at ...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c410GC (Link to this contribution) The actual fall after the legislation was 119,000. All that I have ever argued is that it is wrong t...
Lord Greaves | 710 c404-7GC (Link to this contribution) I heard what the noble Lord said and I hear what he says now, and I understand the point, although I...
Lord Greaves | 710 c412-3GC (Link to this contribution) As the Minister knows, I am not arguing for the Campbell-Savours scheme of trying out the system in ...
Lord Bach | 710 c413-5GC (Link to this contribution) That is a very generous offer, which we shall have to consider. I must move on. In any event, the G...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c404GC (Link to this contribution) Could I give the noble Lord the exact quote, because it is quite important that it is on the record?...
Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 710 c402-3GC (Link to this contribution) If my noble friend will have a little patience, I shall deal with that. The reason is partly because...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c402GC (Link to this contribution) My noble friend says that it is discriminatory. But if a local authority itself has a problem and ap...
Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 710 c402GC (Link to this contribution) The identification of some areas as areas where fraud has occurred would do that. But fraud does not...
Lord Henley | 710 c388GC (Link to this contribution) Of course I am not suggesting that. I am suggesting simply that within the minds of certain people w...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c389GC (Link to this contribution) I am glad that the noble Lord is on his feet, because I want to ask him a question. He mentioned ele...
Lord Henley | 710 c387-8GC (Link to this contribution) I start by expressing my thanks to the Minister for moving his amendment at some length; we are grat...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c388GC (Link to this contribution) What does the noble Lord mean by that phrase, "for their own electoral reasons"?
Lord Henley | 710 c388GC (Link to this contribution) I am not ducking the question; I am just putting it forward as a supposition to the Committee that t...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c388GC (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I could be more blunt. Is the noble Lord suggesting that the Labour Party would be electoral...
Lord Hamilton of Epsom | 710 c393GC (Link to this contribution) Does the noble Lord also accept that in areas such as Kensington, Chelsea and Westminster there are ...
Lord Henley | 710 c389-90GC (Link to this contribution) I am not aware of any electoral fraud in postal voting in the county of Cumbria. I am aware, from cr...
Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 710 c392GC (Link to this contribution) Yes, it is a big issue. I thought we were talking about electoral registration, and it is a big issu...
Lord Greaves | 710 c433-4GC (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for the Minister’s reply, but my understanding is that the districts in Lancashire tha...
Lord Bach | 710 c434GC (Link to this contribution) I can go one stage further and tell the noble Lord that we provided the money so that the software s...
Lord Bach | 710 c435GC (Link to this contribution) Noble Lords will wish to ensure that at elections, returning officers are required to check the pers...
Lord Tyler | 710 c435-6GC (Link to this contribution) I recognise that there is a dilemma here, but putting on the face of the Bill that there should be a...
Lord Greaves | 710 c436GC (Link to this contribution) It would help if the regulations for the announcement of spoilt ballot papers were changed. At the m...
Lord Bates | 710 c442GC (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for the support that the amendment has received from the noble Lord, Lord Rennard. The...
Lord Bates | 710 c439-40GC (Link to this contribution) This amendment, which is in the form of a new clause, deals with an important issue: the enfranchise...
Lord Greaves | 710 c443-6GC (Link to this contribution) This is a distinctly Back-Bench amendment. I will be interested to know what my Front-Bench colleagu...
Lord Bach | 710 c418-9GC (Link to this contribution) Amendment 125B 125B: After Clause 21, insert the following new Clause— "Regulations amending or sup...
Lord Bach | 710 c431GC (Link to this contribution) I do not want to interrupt the noble Lord because I want to shorten this process, if I can, but what...
Lord Bach | 710 c452-4GC (Link to this contribution) Schedule 6: Repeals Amendments 135A to 140B 135A: Schedule 6, page 62, line 4, leave out "In secti...
Lord Bach | 710 c454GC (Link to this contribution) Clause 29: Commencement Amendment 141A 141A: Clause 29, page 23, line 30, at end insert— "( ) sect...
Lord Greaves | 710 c449-50GC (Link to this contribution) I will in a minute. Whether or not the Government keep this matter under review, I shall keep harass...
Lord Rennard | 710 c447-8GC (Link to this contribution) I am sorry if I slightly disappoint my noble friend by saying simply that the problem with his amend...
Lord Bach | 710 c448-9GC (Link to this contribution) The amendment seeks to amend provisions in the 2000 Act concerning absent voting in Great Britain in...
Lord Brooke of Sutton Mandeville | 710 c408-10GC (Link to this contribution) I apologise for having arrived late. One of the hazards of the date of Grand Committee sittings chan...
Lord Greaves | 710 c407-8GC (Link to this contribution) This is exactly what happens at the moment. If someone dies and the local electoral registration sta...
Lord Brooke of Sutton Mandeville | 710 c410GC (Link to this contribution) I had sat down. This argument could go on all night, and I have no intention of prolonging it. Howev...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c407GC (Link to this contribution) On that matter, no one has given us those assurances. The official Opposition have not said that the...
Lord Greaves | 710 c413GC (Link to this contribution) On the same question, I merely wish to make the Minister an offer: if the opportunity arose, I belie...
Lord Bach | 710 c413GC (Link to this contribution) I do not think that they would. What would happen when the first local authority requested the Secre...
Lord Hamilton of Epsom | 710 c399GC (Link to this contribution) I am afraid that the noble Lord, Lord Campbell-Savours, has failed to convince me on this subject. I...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c395-6GC (Link to this contribution) The problem essentially, as the noble Lord, Lord Henley, said, is fraud in the postal vote system. W...
Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 710 c395GC (Link to this contribution) I am a little confused. Perhaps the noble Lord could explain the problem for me. We are talking abou...
Lord Greaves | 710 c396GC (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord will know that I agree entirely with his description of what goes on in many places. ...
Lord Henley | 710 c394GC (Link to this contribution) I speak purely as a lawyer: I cannot say categorically that there is no problem if I do not know whe...
Lord Greaves | 710 c404GC (Link to this contribution) Follow that, really. In speaking to this group of amendments, I specifically support the amendments ...
Lord Neill of Bladen | 710 c403GC (Link to this contribution) Perhaps the noble Baroness will allow me to intervene on the point about annual registration. I beli...
Lord Hamilton of Epsom | 710 c401GC (Link to this contribution) Would it not also have the result of saying to a certain community that it was considered to be more...
Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 710 c389GC (Link to this contribution) I hesitate to intervene on this, but it worries me that such an accusation has been made, and my nob...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c388GC (Link to this contribution) But the noble Lord has suggested it. He has made an accusation that we wish to defer the measure for...
Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 710 c392GC (Link to this contribution) I feel that I must interrupt, because my noble friend Lord Campbell-Savours made the point that this...
Lord Tyler | 710 c431-2GC (Link to this contribution) I was referring to paragraph 8 of Schedule 4 to the Representation of the People Act 2000, where the...
Lord Henley | 710 c438-9GC (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I may deal with the amendments in the order in which they appear. I am grateful that I had a...
Lord Bates | 710 c439GC (Link to this contribution) Amendment 130 130: After Clause 23, insert the following new Clause— "Service declaration (1) Secti...
Lord Bach | 710 c440-2GC (Link to this contribution) The new clause makes amendments to Section 15 of the 1983 Act. Subsection (2) of the new clause woul...
Lord Rennard | 710 c440GC (Link to this contribution) We clearly agree in principle with this amendment. The arguments were well put by the noble Lord, Lo...
Lord Greaves | 710 c443GC (Link to this contribution) Amendment 132A 132A: After Clause 23, insert the following new Clause— "Absent voting (1) Schedule ...
Lord Bach | 710 c415-8GC (Link to this contribution) Of course, I shall write to my noble friend with the answer to the first question, but for an ERO to...
Lord Bach | 710 c419-21GC (Link to this contribution) Amendment 125C 125C: After Clause 21, insert the following new Clause— "Report by Electoral Commiss...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c427GC (Link to this contribution) I cannot understand why the noble Lord wants to publish a Member’s address but not their source of e...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c424-5GC (Link to this contribution) I shall speak briefly to the amendment. I would like to think that it will get the support of the Co...
Lord Tyler | 710 c425-6GC (Link to this contribution) Perhaps it would be appropriate to say a word about the context. I have some sympathy with what the ...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c426GC (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I could answer that, although I have not seen the Electoral Commission’s brief on any of the...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c429GC (Link to this contribution) I have listened to the protests of those who object to this amendment not in principle but to the de...
Lord Bach | 710 c427-9GC (Link to this contribution) My noble friend is seeking to increase the information available to electors about candidates’ pecun...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c429GC (Link to this contribution) I am surprised that the noble Lord is so vigorous in his objections. "Any pecuniary interest" may we...
Lord Henley | 710 c430GC (Link to this contribution) Amendment 128 128: After Clause 23, insert the following new Clause— "Absent voting: personal ident...
Lord Bach | 710 c452GC (Link to this contribution) Yes, it was a bit of a chance—the noble Lord is right—but I hope that I have just about got away wit...
Lord Bates | 710 c452GC (Link to this contribution) I associate myself with the sentiments of the noble Lord, Lord Tyler, towards the Minister, the nobl...
Lord Bach | 710 c387GC (Link to this contribution) Debate on Amendment 125A resumed. Before we adjourned last Wednesday, I moved Amendment 125A and s...
Viscount Ullswater | 710 c387GC (Link to this contribution) If there is a Division in the Chamber while we are sitting, the Committee will adjourn as soon as th...
Lord Greaves | 710 c407GC (Link to this contribution) This is the extent to which I agree with the noble Lord, Lord Campbell-Savours, and thank him for ra...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c410GC (Link to this contribution) I know that the noble Lord is not doing that, but others have. Something else came out when I looked...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c413GC (Link to this contribution) Does that not completely misunderstand the nature of the debate that is going on in these communitie...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c415GC (Link to this contribution) I do not expect my noble friend to answer directly now my two questions. Is it true that EROs are pa...
Lord Bach | 710 c412GC (Link to this contribution) I suspect that, first, the area that was chosen would feel—I use this word carefully—discriminated a...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c412GC (Link to this contribution) My noble friend said that confusion might be caused. Would that be because some people might find th...
Lord Bach | 710 c410-2GC (Link to this contribution) We have had a substantial debate, quite rightly, on the major new clauses that we are proposing here...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c396-9GC (Link to this contribution) I think that the noble Lord has a case. However, if an electoral registration officer within the loc...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c393-4GC (Link to this contribution) I am glad the noble Lord has raised that valid point because it draws further attention to the inval...
Lord Hamilton of Epsom | 710 c393GC (Link to this contribution) I started my canvassing career in north Kensington, which at the time was a marginal Labour seat, an...
Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 710 c403-4GC (Link to this contribution) Absolutely; I could not agree more with the noble Lord. That is why we have not introduced a system ...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c402GC (Link to this contribution) My noble friend says that the report is out of date. Perhaps I can give her the latest figures, whic...
Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 710 c402GC (Link to this contribution) I disagree, because a local authority has a right to go to the Secretary of State within the context...
Lord Henley | 710 c389GC (Link to this contribution) As I have made clear to the noble Lord, Lord Campbell-Savours—and if the noble Baroness looks at my ...
Lord Henley | 710 c388GC (Link to this contribution) Well, I would not like to go much further than the particular words that I used. I shall leave it to...
Lord Rennard | 710 c390-1GC (Link to this contribution) I welcome, of course, the thrust of the government amendment to introduce personal identifiers, on t...
Lord Campbell-Savours | 710 c391-2GC (Link to this contribution) I might delay the Committee a little today because I want to speak in some detail on this issue, whi...
Lord Henley | 710 c392GC (Link to this contribution) I only know about one part of one county—a very large county. I do not know for a fact whether there...

Subjects

Disclosure of information
Databases
Armed forces
Candidates
Absent voting
Fraud
Finance
Elections
Electoral register
Northern Ireland
Political parties
Members' interests
Proof of identity
Voting rights
Councillors' interests
Information sharing

Legislation

Political Parties and Elections Bill 2007-08 to 2008-09

Link

View this Parliamentary proceeding on www.publications.parliament.uk
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