UK Parliament / Open data

Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill

Committee of the Whole House (HL) and Debate on bills on Monday, 22 November 2021, in the House of Lords.
Lords committee stage tenth day. New clauses considered. (Part 1 of 2).

About these Parliamentary proceedings

Reference

816 cc592-662 

Session

2021-22

Department

Ministry of Justice

Legislative stage

Committee stage

Procedure

New clauses

Chamber / Committee

House of Lords chamber

Show all related items (9)
Legislative scrutiny: Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill: youth justice. Joint Committee on Human Rights sixth report.
Wednesday, 15 September 2021
Parliamentary committees
House of Lords
House of Commons
Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill
Monday, 22 November 2021
Parliamentary proceedings
House of Lords
Deposited Paper DEP2021-0955
Tuesday, 30 November 2021
Deposited papers
House of Lords
Deposited Paper DEP2021-0956
Tuesday, 30 November 2021
Deposited papers
House of Lords

Proceeding contributions

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 c592 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Falconer of Thoroton

268: After Clause 170, insert the following new Cl...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 cc592-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, Section 28 of the Youth Justice and Criminal Evidence Act 1999 allows for the cross-exa...


Show all contributions (94)
Lord Thomas of Gresford | 816 cc593-4 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I very much understand the impatience of the noble and learned Lord, Lord Falconer, for...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 c594 (Link to this contribution)

In this group, according to my listing, Amendment 268 is grouped with Amendments 286, 287, 288, 2...

Lord Thomas of Gresford | 816 cc594-5 (Link to this contribution)

That introduces the question about the complainant’s sexual history; I do not think the noble and...

Baroness Jones of Moulsecoomb | 816 cc595-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support these improved safeguards because although I have not been in court very ofte...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 c596 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I should have opened those other amendments, and it is an error on my part that I did n...

Lord Judge | 816 c596 (Link to this contribution)

If the noble and learned Lord decides to open them, which I would welcome, I would like to respon...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 c596 (Link to this contribution)

The reason I did not tell noble Lords why I strongly supported all these amendments was because I...

Lord Pannick | 816 c596 (Link to this contribution)

I am sorry to interrupt the noble and learned Lord, but would his amendment mean that if the comp...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 c596 (Link to this contribution)

It would exclude such evidence; there is no doubt about that, and rightly so, because what the no...

Lord Pannick | 816 c597 (Link to this contribution)

I would like to test this proposition, because it strikes me as rather surprising. If a complaina...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 c597 (Link to this contribution)

What I am saying in putting forward this provision is that you want to send a clear signal that a...

Lord Brown of Eaton-under-Heywood | 816 c597 (Link to this contribution)

Surely the noble Lord and the noble and learned Lord must be at cross purposes. The noble Lord, L...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 c597 (Link to this contribution)

I am afraid I did understand what the noble Lord, Lord Pannick, said. It is exactly as the noble ...

Baroness Jones of Moulsecoomb | 816 c597 (Link to this contribution)

From a woman’s point of view, I would just like to say that there are things I would have done at...

Baroness Fox of Buckley | 816 c597 (Link to this contribution)

As a woman, I say that the past might not be relevant but the truth might be, if you have just sa...

Baroness Bennett of Manor Castle | 816 c598 (Link to this contribution)

I point out to all noble Lords who have spoken that victims can be of all genders. It is unfortun...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 cc598-9 (Link to this contribution)

The noble Baroness, Lady Bennett, is right. This is about sexual assault on anybody, whatever gen...

Lord Judge | 816 c599 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I once tried a case where the most compelling evidence was given by a black woman who a...

Lord Pannick | 816 c600 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I intervened earlier on Amendment 286 because of my concern about an absolute rule in t...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 c600 (Link to this contribution)

On the points made by the noble and learned Lord, Lord Judge, about the criminal procedure rules,...

Baroness Chakrabarti | 816 c601 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am sorry to find myself intervening at this point but there is no bigger policy than ...

Lord Stewart of Dirleton | 816 cc601-4 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, in replying, I preface my remarks by commenting on points made by noble Lords. The firs...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 c605 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful to everybody for taking part in the debate and very grateful for the care with whic...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 c605 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Falconer of Thoroton

269: After Clause 170, insert the following new Cl...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 c606 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, this is a completely different topic. Amendment 269 would

“ensure that bereaved p...

Baroness Bennett of Manor Castle | 816 cc606-7 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I rise to offer Green support for Amendment 269 in the name of the noble and learned Lo...

Baroness Newlove | 816 cc607-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support this amendment. As a former Victims Commissioner, I have met too many victims...

Lord Mackay of Clashfern | 816 c608 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, some time ago when the Hillsborough matter was before this House, the noble Lord, Lord ...

Lord Beith | 816 cc608-9 (Link to this contribution)

We have always been able to rely on the noble and learned Lord, Lord Mackay, for ingenuity when d...

Lord Pannick | 816 cc609-610 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I too support the principle behind Amendment 269. We regularly see the disturbing prosp...

Lord Sandhurst | 816 c610 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I shall speak shortly. I have always had a long interest in legal aid and its proper pr...

Baroness Chakrabarti | 816 c611 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support this whole group of amendments from my noble and learned friend and others. T...

Lord Bach | 816 cc611-2 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I also agree absolutely with the principles behind these amendments. It seems as though...

Lord Stewart of Dirleton | 816 cc612-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I hope that the Committee will accept my words when I say that the Government are sympa...

Lord Paddick | 816 c613 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have given evidence at numerous criminal trials, in the magistrates’ court and the Cr...

Lord Stewart of Dirleton | 816 c614 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful to the noble Lord for giving the Committee the benefit of his experience. Perhaps i...

Baroness Chakrabarti | 816 c614 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful to the Minister for giving way. I do not doubt the sincerity of his concerns about ...

Lord Stewart of Dirleton | 816 c614 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful to the noble Baroness for her intervention.

I was going on to say that, for b...

Baroness Newlove | 816 cc614-5 (Link to this contribution)

I take on board what my noble and learned friend says. I come from a victim’s perspective in all ...

Lord Stewart of Dirleton | 816 c615 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, my noble friend’s personal experience and her service as Victims’ Commissioner lend for...

Baroness Bennett of Manor Castle | 816 c615 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the Minister for giving way. He said that it is right that families should be represented...

Lord Stewart of Dirleton | 816 cc615-6 (Link to this contribution)

Ultimately, my Lords, arrival at the truth is the objective of all legal process in this area, bu...

Lord Mackay of Clashfern | 816 c616 (Link to this contribution)

Before the noble and learned Lord sits down, I made a mistake earlier in not referring to the nob...

Lord Stewart of Dirleton | 816 c616 (Link to this contribution)

Before the noble and learned Lord, Lord Falconer of Thoroton, replies, I should say that I did no...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 cc616-7 (Link to this contribution)

I am very grateful to everybody who has spoken in the debate. Everybody apart from the Minister s...

Baroness Kennedy of Cradley | 816 c617 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Baroness Kennedy of Cradley

277: After Clause 170, insert the following new ...

Baroness Kennedy of Cradley | 816 cc618-620 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I shall speak to Amendment 277 in my name and I fully support Amendment 292C in the nam...

Baroness Brinton | 816 cc620-1 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I wish to support both amendments, and echo the very strong points made by the noble Ba...

Baroness Newlove | 816 cc621-4 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, as the former Victims’ Commissioner, I am amazed by these time limits. To find our dome...

Baroness Chakrabarti | 816 cc623-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support both noble Baronesses’ amendments and urge the Minister to accept them with a...

Lord Russell of Liverpool | 816 cc625-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I was very happy to put my name to the amendment in the name of the noble Baroness, Lad...

Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 816 cc626-7 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have added my name to the amendment in the name of the noble Baroness, Lady Newlove; ...

Lord Pannick | 816 c627 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I, too, support these amendments. I shall add two very brief points in relation to Amen...

Lord Thomas of Gresford | 816 cc628-9 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am disappointed that the noble Lord, Lord Pannick, did not refer to the opinion of th...

Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede | 816 cc629-630 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support both these amendments. My noble friend Lady Kennedy of Cradley is seeking to ...

Lord Stewart of Dirleton | 816 cc630-1 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Kennedy of Cradley, for her amendment.

For the v...

Baroness Chakrabarti | 816 c631 (Link to this contribution)

Obviously I will go and read the Georgian case—I will call it “the Georgian case” so as not to re...

Lord Stewart of Dirleton | 816 cc632-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I acknowledge the long-standing interest and expertise of the noble Baroness, Lady Chak...

Baroness Kennedy of Cradley | 816 c633 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am grateful to all noble Lords and noble and learned Lords who have spoken in today’s...

Baroness Jones of Moulsecoomb | 816 cc633-4 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Baroness Jones of Moulsecoomb

278: After Clause 170, insert the following ne...

Baroness Jones of Moulsecoomb | 816 cc634-5 (Link to this contribution)

The two amendments I have tabled in this group are not on such a weighty issue as the sexual crim...

Baroness Harris of Richmond | 816 cc635-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have added my name to these amendments, which are indeed timely. Back in May 2011, du...

Lord Bach | 816 cc636-640 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, Amendment 292D is in my name. I hope that noble Lords will indulge me if I respond with...

Lord Bach | 816 c638 (Link to this contribution)

I am sorry that it has taken so long. I have waited a long time for this opportunity in the Commi...

Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 816 cc638-642 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have added my name to these two amendments and I hope the Minister will agree to take...

Lord Brown of Eaton-under-Heywood | 816 c642 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I briefly but strongly support Amendment 292D, but not the other two—I say that without...

Lord Hogan-Howe | 816 cc642-4 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support the noble Lord, Lord Bach, in his amendment. He could have added police offic...

Lord Carlile of Berriew | 816 cc644-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I also rise to speak particularly about Amendment 292D. I support the noble Lord, Lord ...

Lord Paddick | 816 c645 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, with the greatest respect to the noble Lord, Lord Carlile of Berriew, when he started t...

Lord Bach | 816 c645 (Link to this contribution)

Would the noble Lord forgive me for a moment? I know his view has always been consistent on this,...

Lord Paddick | 816 cc645-6 (Link to this contribution)

Yes, and, as the noble Lord will very well know, in a coalition there have to be compromises on b...

Lord Rosser | 816 cc646-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I agree with the comments of my noble friend Lord Hunt of Kings Heath, and other noble ...

Lord Sharpe of Epsom | 816 cc647-650 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Jones of Moulsecoomb, and the noble Lord, Lord Bach, f...

Baroness Jones of Moulsecoomb | 816 c650 (Link to this contribution)

Is the Minister advising me to withdraw my amendment or asking me to withdraw it?

I made my...

Baroness Scott of Bybrook | 816 c651 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, we will do one more group before the dinner break. I remind noble Lords that we have to...

Baroness Coussins | 816 c651 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Baroness Coussins

280: After Clause 170, insert the following new Clause—

Baroness Coussins | 816 cc651-4 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am grateful to the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Leeds, the noble Lord, Lord M...

Lord Falconer of Thoroton | 816 c653 (Link to this contribution)

Before the noble Baroness sits down, may I ask a question? Her amendment refers to every court or...

Baroness Coussins | 816 c653 (Link to this contribution)

I can answer that only by saying I would have to consult the national register and chartered inst...

Bishop of Leeds | 816 cc653-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I endorse every word of what the noble Baroness just said. In a previous incarnation—th...

Lord Hogan-Howe | 816 c655 (Link to this contribution)

I too support this amendment. I was really surprised that there is not already a standard and tha...

Lord Thomas of Gresford | 816 cc656-7 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, when I was a young solicitor in north Wales, I recall a knock on the door at about 6 o’...

Lord Berkeley of Knighton | 816 c657 (Link to this contribution)

I wholeheartedly endorse my noble friend’s amendment, having seen on a couple of occasions interp...

Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 816 cc657-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have put my name to this amendment for all the reasons put forward by the noble Baron...

Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede | 816 cc658-9 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, this has been a very interesting debate and I thank the noble Baroness for moving her a...

Lord Stewart of Dirleton | 816 cc659-660 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, Amendment 280 would restrict the Ministry of Justice to appoint in our courts and tribu...

Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 816 c660 (Link to this contribution)

I take it the Minister would accept that legislation could quite easily disapply those regulation...

Lord Stewart of Dirleton | 816 cc660-1 (Link to this contribution)

Hypothetically, yes, but I hesitate to give the noble Lord a definite commitment on that, as my i...

Lord Hogan-Howe | 816 c661 (Link to this contribution)

There are just two points that I would like to have clarified. First, the noble Baroness, Lady Co...

Lord Stewart of Dirleton | 816 cc661-2 (Link to this contribution)

As I think I have said, the contract provides that, at the highest level, the standard is commens...

Baroness Coussins | 816 c662 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I thank the Minister for his detailed reply and all noble Lords who have contributed to...

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