UK Parliament / Open data

Localism Bill

Committee of the Whole House (HL) and Debate on bills on Tuesday, 28 June 2011, in the House of Lords.
Localism Bill. Lords committee stage third day. Clauses 28 to 41 agreed to. Clause 42 under consideration.

About these Parliamentary proceedings

Reference

728 c1639-57, c1669-708, c1724-50 

Session

2010-12

Department

Department for Communities and Local Government

Legislative stage

Committee stage

Procedure

New clauses

Chamber / Committee

House of Lords chamber

Related items

Localism Bill. Brought from the Commons. In two volumes. Explanatory Notes HL Bill 71-EN also published.
Thursday, 19 May 2011
Bills
House of Lords
Delegated Powers and Regulatory Reform Committee. Fifteenth report on: Education Bill; Localism Bill Parts 1 to 3. (Lords Minutes).
Wednesday, 15 June 2011
Parliamentary committees
House of Lords

Proceeding contributions

Lord Beecham | 728 c1648 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I expect your Lordships will be familiar with the provisions of the Local Democracy, Econo...
Lord Tope | 728 c1652-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not want to disappoint the noble Lord, Lord Beecham, and I will not do so. Once again...

Show all contributions (131)
Lord Shutt of Greetland | 728 c1649-50 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I will not please you all but I thank noble Lords who have taken part in this debate. This...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1650 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I entirely agree with noble Lords who reject the notion of overprescription in this or any...
Lord Tope | 728 c1648-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Lord began by suggesting that we might not remember the provisions of the local ...
Lord Greaves | 728 c1649 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I underline what my noble friend has just said. I am sorry that the noble Baroness, Lady A...
Lord Tope | 728 c1651 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I would never presume to take my noble friend Lord Shipley to one side, not least because ...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1651 (Link to this contribution) Indeed, but had he been here, I assume he would have supported the amendment to which he has ascribe...
Lord Greaves | 728 c1650 (Link to this contribution) In my defence, I should say that there are two lines of attack for Governments, although I should no...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1650-1 (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord will be aware that, no doubt for good reasons, I was not a member of the previous Lab...
Lord Shutt of Greetland | 728 c1653-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am delighted to respond once more to further rejoicing. I thank the noble Lords for thei...
Lord Greaves | 728 c1653 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I cannot resist adding just a little bit to what has been said. I went back to the Local D...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1654-5 (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for this reply. His council’s example is one that many councils follow and woul...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1655-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this is a different matter. We are now on to a substantive issue which the Government seek...
Lord Greaves | 728 c1656 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Lord is persuasive in his arguments by suggesting that what is happening here is...
Lord Shutt of Greetland | 728 c1656-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, Clause 30 removes powers that enable local authorities to run pilot waste reduction scheme...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1657 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this is another case of local authorities having the power to do anything they like except...
Lord Greaves | 728 c1669-70 (Link to this contribution) 109A: After Clause 30, insert the following new Clause— ““CHAPTER 8 Appropriation and disposal of la...
Lord Greaves | 728 c1670 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, Amendment 109A, which is on its own, is a long and apparently complex amendment, but it ne...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1670-1 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord for moving this amendment. We were not quite clear what wa...
Lord Greaves | 728 c1671-2 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for that reply and I will, of course, withdraw the amendment...
Lord Wigley | 728 c1672 (Link to this contribution) 110: Clause 31, page 29, line 11, at end insert— ““( ) Only a Welsh Minister may require a local or ...
Baroness Hanham | 728 c1671 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank both noble Lords for those short contributions—short, I suspect, because I have in...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 728 c1679-80 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, like many other noble Lords I share the concerns expressed about these provisions. I want ...
Baroness Greengross | 728 c1678-9 (Link to this contribution) I am not suggesting the detailed mechanism now. I agree with the noble Lord that we have to get this...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1678 (Link to this contribution) In terms of proving ““beyond reasonable doubt””, would the noble Baroness accept that the arbitratio...
Baroness Greengross | 728 c1678 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, first, I declare an interest as the vice-president of the Local Government Association. I ...
Baroness Gardner of Parkes | 728 c1675-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I shall speak to Amendments 111 to 114. Part 2 makes it possible for a Minister to require...
Lord Tope | 728 c1673-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, as well as speaking to Amendments 110A and 186B, I shall speak particularly to Amendments ...
Lord Wigley | 728 c1672-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, Amendment 110, in my name, introduces a significant group of amendments on the fundamental...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 728 c1680-2 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, a number of us mentioned this matter at Second Reading. One of the longest lists of noble ...
Lord Best | 728 c1682 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I support the two amendments in the name of the noble Baroness, Lady Eaton. She has to be ...
Baroness Valentine | 728 c1682-3 (Link to this contribution) I declare an interest as chief executive of London First, a not-for-profit business membership organ...
Lord Berkeley | 728 c1683-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I support all those who have spoken so far to express concern about this group of amendmen...
Baroness Kramer | 728 c1689 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am afraid that I am a local government novice rather than a local government guru. Howev...
Lord Newton of Braintree | 728 c1687-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it is probably rash of me to intervene in a debate that has so far been dominated largely ...
Lord Empey | 728 c1686-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I wanted to speak briefly to Amendment 110 and to make a few other comments, but it would ...
Earl Cathcart | 728 c1684-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, as this is the first time I have spoken in Committee, I should declare that I am a landlor...
Lord Empey | 728 c1687 (Link to this contribution) I beg your pardon; I may have picked up a comment from someone else. When the Government are finali...
Lord Berkeley | 728 c1687 (Link to this contribution) I should like to say that it was not me who suggested that the British Government had not been fined...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1689-92 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I speak to Amendments 117ZA and 117ZB, to Amendments 110A and 114A, to which we have added...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1695 (Link to this contribution) I understand that point. My specific question was whether those four areas that I identified are of ...
Earl Attlee | 728 c1695-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I think I will be able to give the noble Lord some comfort later in my speech. The noble L...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1692-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I entirely endorse the observations made by my noble friend Lord McKenzie. I was happy to ...
Earl Attlee | 728 c1694-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank the Committee for the time, effort and thought that has been put into the amendmen...
Earl Attlee | 728 c1696-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I will be delighted to deal with the noble Lord’s point later in my speech. I was very in...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 728 c1696 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry; my noble friend is clearly doing his best, but the draft statement was obviously drawn u...
Earl Attlee | 728 c1696 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I believe that that is the intention of my noble friend’s amendment; the meter would run o...
Lord Newton of Braintree | 728 c1696 (Link to this contribution) My noble friend has been very reassuring on general retrospection and I think I understand the point...
Lord Berkeley | 728 c1697 (Link to this contribution) The Minister mentioned ability to pay. If a council has no money, does that mean that the Government...
Lord Wigley | 728 c1697 (Link to this contribution) As I flagged up at Second Reading on 7 June, the Minister in another place said that this is likely ...
Earl Attlee | 728 c1697-8 (Link to this contribution) I am coming to that. The noble Lord, Lord Wigley, asked whether the Government will give an assuranc...
Lord Newton of Braintree | 728 c1698 (Link to this contribution) I had actually decided not to intervene, because it seemed almost unfair. There is nothing more cert...
Earl Attlee | 728 c1698-9 (Link to this contribution) My noble friend Lord Jenkin asked where we are in negotiations with outside bodies. He is of course,...
Lord Berkeley | 728 c1699 (Link to this contribution) Will the Minister explain his last reference to the different types of organisations that might be c...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1699 (Link to this contribution) Noble Lords will be grateful for the response that the Minister has made because he has indicated th...
Earl Attlee | 728 c1699 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am very happy to enter into detailed discussions with any noble Lord.
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1699 (Link to this contribution) I know the Minister has gone through a lot this evening on this. It is not just a question of design...
Earl Attlee | 728 c1699 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Lord will know that infraction proceedings are a very long process, even after t...
Baroness Kramer | 728 c1702-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we have just been through a very important debate that has taken a good two hours. I sense...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1704-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we understand why the smaller of the amendments has been introduced tonight. Doubtless the...
Lord Shipley | 728 c1705 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I want to add a word from the perspective of English core cities. The proposals around tax...
Earl Attlee | 728 c1700 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, inspiration has arrived regarding one of the questions asked by the noble Lord, Lord McKen...
Lord Tope | 728 c1700 (Link to this contribution) I think that came from all sides of the House. The Government have perhaps recognised that shadow ma...
Baroness Kramer | 728 c1702 (Link to this contribution) 118: Before Clause 38, insert the following new Clause— ““Tax increment financing (1) The Business R...
Lord Wigley | 728 c1700-2 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I shall not detain the House very long in winding up this fairly substantial debate. I tha...
Earl Attlee | 728 c1700 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Lord makes an important point, but the amendment tabled by the noble Lord, Lord ...
Lord Tope | 728 c1700 (Link to this contribution) Before the noble Lord, Lord Wigley, tell us what he is going to do with his amendment which, as we w...
Lord Shutt of Greetland | 728 c1728 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank the noble Lords who have contributed to this debate. It might be easier if I start...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1728 (Link to this contribution) Just so that we can tick off this item as we go along, my amendment to include the business rate wou...
Lord True | 728 c1727-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I intervene briefly from the perspective of a local authority. I think that most local aut...
Lord Cameron of Dillington | 728 c1727 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I support the right reverend Prelate in his intention to oppose the clause standing part. ...
Bishop of Birmingham | 728 c1726-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it might help to progress the debate if I admit that I am speaking on behalf of my right r...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1725-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I shall also speak to the other two amendments in the group. These are probing amendments,...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1724 (Link to this contribution) 118A: Clause 39, page 35, line 35, after ““tax”” insert ““or non-domestic rates””
Baroness Kramer | 728 c1707-8 (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister. I am not sure that we are a whole lot clearer on the commencement date but per...
Lord Shutt of Greetland | 728 c1706-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I hope I can be helpful on this but, while thanking all noble Lords who have spoken, I rev...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1705-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Shipley, is quite right to refer to the support for the principle fro...
Lord Tope | 728 c1732 (Link to this contribution) 118E: Clause 41, page 36, line 32, at end insert— ““( ) The chargeable day must not fall outside the...
Lord Shutt of Greetland | 728 c1729 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, that may well be the case, but that is for another day. This clause makes it clear that th...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1728-9 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry. I promise not to interrupt the noble Lord again, well maybe no more than once. I accept ...
Bishop of Birmingham | 728 c1730 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful for the Minister’s categorical, firm and straightforward support for chariti...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1730 (Link to this contribution) I am very grateful to the Minister for his full explanation and for dealing with these points. In pa...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1730-1 (Link to this contribution) The thrust of Clause 40 is to automate the small business multiplier to improve uptake of the small ...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1730 (Link to this contribution) 118D: Clause 40, page 36, line 26, at end insert— ““( ) A billing authority in England must promote ...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1732 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for that response. It would be helpful if he could write wit...
Lord Shutt of Greetland | 728 c1731-2 (Link to this contribution) I thank the noble Lord for moving this amendment. Authorities are already under a statutory duty to ...
Lord Shutt of Greetland | 728 c1728 (Link to this contribution) I understand that this is in order that the national business rate can be relieved by local governme...
Lord Tope | 728 c1733 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment. Amendment 118E withdrawn. Clause 41 agreed. Clau...
Lord Shutt of Greetland | 728 c1733 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have several papers here but that figure is not within them. I imagine this was raised w...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1733 (Link to this contribution) Does the noble Lord have a figure for the extent to which those who are getting the benefit of the r...
Lord Rennard | 728 c1737-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I should declare an interest as a recent vice-president of the Local Government Associatio...
Earl Cathcart | 728 c1735-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, my noble friend Lord True has ably moved those amendments where he is the lead name, and h...
Lord True | 728 c1734-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I rise to speak to Amendments 119, 120 and technical Amendment 121 in my name. I also supp...
Lord True | 728 c1733 (Link to this contribution) 119: Clause 42, page 37, line 20, leave out ““must”” and insert ““may””
Lord Shutt of Greetland | 728 c1733 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, from day one, the Government have been committed to providing meaningful help to businesse...
Lord Tope | 728 c1733 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, Amendment 118E is fairly clear and straightforward. In view of the time and in order to ma...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1744-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank my noble friend Lord True and, indeed, all other noble Lords who have spoken on th...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 728 c1747 (Link to this contribution) My noble friend said earlier that the Bill gives the Government power to alter the minimum numbers f...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1742 (Link to this contribution) It will be a real test of political leadership to withstand populist pressure of that kind. One of t...
Earl of Lytton | 728 c1742-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, as this is my first contribution at this stage of the Bill, I declare an interest as the p...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1741-2 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, not for the first time Newcastle is united in connection with the amendment in the name of...
Lord Greaves | 728 c1742 (Link to this contribution) Before the noble Lord sits down, will he comment on the view that in many cases, whether or not a re...
Lord Greaves | 728 c1738-40 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to my noble friend for turning up in time so I did not have to deliver his s...
Lord Shipley | 728 c1740 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I shall speak to Amendment 122 and briefly make the case for a 10 per cent trigger. There ...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1747 (Link to this contribution) I thank my noble friend. One can rely on one’s noble friends to provide the testing question. Clause...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 728 c1747 (Link to this contribution) I am extremely grateful to my noble friend. He was quite right when he said originally that Clause 2...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1748 (Link to this contribution) My noble friend is not the only one to be pleased to have got the answer as quickly as that. Through...
Lord True | 728 c1749-50 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am very grateful to my noble friend for his very thoughtful and considerate response to ...
Baroness Byford | 728 c1748 (Link to this contribution) Having listened very patiently, I have a very short question for the Minister. In his response he sa...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1748 (Link to this contribution) I am not able to give a specific answer to that. All I can say is that the noble Baroness will be aw...
Lord Greaves | 728 c1748 (Link to this contribution) I have just a couple of points. When we get to Clause 56 on parish councils we will have a stand par...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1749 (Link to this contribution) My noble friend poses a complex question at this hour of the day and I am sure he will forgive me if...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1639-41 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this is a substantial group of amendments that includes several government amendments. Per...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1641-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, first, I thank the noble Lord for introducing the government amendments. Indeed, I thank t...
Lord True | 728 c1643-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, perhaps I can speak briefly to Amendment 105 but before doing so, I pray the indulgence of...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1644 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I understand the noble Lord’s point, but I have to say that it would be a huge infraction ...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1639 (Link to this contribution) 99: Clause 22, page 25, line 32, leave out ““senior””
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1647 (Link to this contribution) 109: Clause 27, page 28, line 20, at end insert— ““(5A) In this Chapter ““remuneration””, in relatio...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1647 (Link to this contribution) 106: Clause 23, page 26, line 17, leave out ““senior”” 107: Clause 23, page 26, line 34, leave out...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1647 (Link to this contribution) 108A: Clause 27, page 27, line 28, leave out from ““following”” to end of line 32 Amendment 108A ag...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1646 (Link to this contribution) 102: Clause 22, page 26, line 5, leave out ““senior”” Amendment 102 agreed. Amendment 102A not mov...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1646-7 (Link to this contribution) 103: Clause 23, page 26, line 9, leave out ““senior”” 104: Clause 23, page 26, line 15, leave out ...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1646 (Link to this contribution) 101: Clause 22, page 25, line 35, at end insert ““, (b) the remuneration of its lowest-paid employee...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 728 c1645-6 (Link to this contribution) Before we conclude, I thank the Minister for what he said. We accept that from the Government’s pers...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1646 (Link to this contribution) I understand exactly what the noble Lord is referring to, but I hope it has expedited this debate to...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1644-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this has been a short but very useful debate on a very important aspect of local governmen...
Lord Beecham | 728 c1651-2 (Link to this contribution) This is another example, and I think I can anticipate the response that I am likely to receive from ...
Lord Taylor of Holbeach | 728 c1646 (Link to this contribution) 100: Clause 22, page 25, line 34, leave out ““senior”” Amendment 100 agreed. Amendment 101A (to Am...
Earl Attlee | 728 c1697 (Link to this contribution) Not quite, my Lords, but the decision-making process will have to ensure that what the council pays ...
Lord Tope | 728 c1733 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister. It is indeed sufficient.

Subjects

Devolved matters
Business
Air pollution
Arts
Fees and charges
Land
Fines
Infrastructure
European communities
EU action
Domestic waste
Local government
Northern Ireland
Pay
Payments
Property transfer
Public sector
Business rates
Referendums
Procurement
Local government services
Public participation
Staff
Low pay
Scotland
Small businesses
Wales
Waste disposal
Tax rates and bands
Regeneration
Sanctions
Petitions

Legislation

Localism Bill 2010-12

Link

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