Natural Environment and Rural Communities Bill. Lords Committee stage first day. Clause 1 agreed to. Schedule 1 as amended agreed to. Clause 2 under consideration.
Natural Environment and Rural Communities Bill
Committee of the Whole House (HL)
and
Debate on bills on Tuesday, 24 January 2006,
in the House of Lords.
About these Parliamentary proceedings
Reference
677 c1093-142Session
2005-06Legislative stage
Committee stageChamber / Committee
House of Lords chamberRelated items
Natural Environment and Rural Communities Bill. Brought from the Commons. Explanatory notes HL Bill 23-EN also published.
Wednesday, 12 October 2005
Bills
House of Lords
Wednesday, 12 October 2005
Bills
House of Lords
Proceeding contributions
Lord Bach | 677 c1093 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I beg to move that the House do now resolve itself into Committee on this Bill.
Moved acc...
Lord Dixon-Smith | 677 c1093-4 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 1:"Page 1, line 7, after ““as”” insert ““the Commission for””"
The noble Lord s...
Show all contributions (93)
Lord Dixon-Smith | 677 c1096-7 (Link to this contribution)
I am grateful to all those who have taken part in this debate and supported my gentle little argumen...
Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer | 677 c1097-8 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 9:"Page 1, line 13, at end insert ““or other persons””"
The noble Baroness said...
Baroness Byford | 677 c1098-9 (Link to this contribution)
In following the noble Baroness, Lady Miller of Chilthorne Domer, I speak to Amendment No. 10, which...
Earl Peel | 677 c1095 (Link to this contribution)
Perhaps I may intervene. I had no intention of doing so. I entirely accept what my noble friend Lord...
Baroness Byford | 677 c1095 (Link to this contribution)
I support this proposal. There is confusion in the country. ““Natural England”” means many things to...
Lord Rotherwick | 677 c1095-6 (Link to this contribution)
I declare my interests as a farmer who deals with SSSIs and nature reserves. This name, which has be...
Lord Bach | 677 c1096 (Link to this contribution)
I thank all noble Lords who have taken part in the debate. I wonder whether the historians among us ...
Lord Carter | 677 c1094-5 (Link to this contribution)
As the noble Lord, Lord Dixon-Smith, pointed out, the Public Bill Office has done a first class job ...
Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer | 677 c1095 (Link to this contribution)
Of course names are important. I welcome this very short debate, to which I do not intend to contrib...
Countess of Mar | 677 c1095 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I declare an interest as a partner in a small family farm. When I first heard that this or...
Earl of Erroll | 677 c1100 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, following on from what has just been said, I started to think about the potential problems...
Earl Peel | 677 c1099-100 (Link to this contribution)
I am extremely grateful to my noble friend for raising these important issues. I am bound to say tha...
Earl Peel | 677 c1103 (Link to this contribution)
Before the Minister sits down, I still have a degree of confusion about this. As things stand, if a ...
Lord Bach | 677 c1100-3 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I will deal with these amendments in terms of why the Bill is as it is drafted. I will do ...
Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer | 677 c1103-4 (Link to this contribution)
I thank noble Lords who have spoken in this illuminating debate. The Minister is right that as we pr...
Lord Bach | 677 c1103 (Link to this contribution)
I will give the noble Earl a definitive answer in the letter I will send his noble friend. However, ...
Baroness O'Cathain | 677 c1107-8 (Link to this contribution)
In view of what my noble friend has been discussing in terms of the operation of the boards, I find ...
Baroness Byford | 677 c1104-7 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 21:"Page 44, line 14, after ““appointed”” insert ““following an interview and op...
Lord Clark of Windermere | 677 c1108-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, first, I declare an interest as chairman of the Forestry Commission, which is not a non-de...
Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer | 677 c1108 (Link to this contribution)
The noble Baroness, Lady Byford, has raised a number of interesting issues for debate. Things have m...
Lord Rotherwick | 677 c1112 (Link to this contribution)
The whole House accepts that Ministers are in that situation as well.
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1111-2 (Link to this contribution)
I shall certainly read and consider the points that the noble Baroness makes, but long experience in...
Baroness O'Cathain | 677 c1111 (Link to this contribution)
I hate to interrupt the noble Baroness. In the corporate sector, Sir Derek Higgs brought in the code...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1110-1 (Link to this contribution)
In seeking to reply to the amendments and to the points raised by noble Lords, I will try to cover t...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1112 (Link to this contribution)
I can certainly attempt to get a comprehensive list, and we will furnish information from the most c...
Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer | 677 c1112 (Link to this contribution)
As the Minister is looking at this issue, might she be able to furnish us before Report with a list ...
Baroness O'Cathain | 677 c1112 (Link to this contribution)
I shall spend some time walking the Minister through the issues, if she likes. The point about pensi...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1112 (Link to this contribution)
The point is taken, but Members of this House do not receive a salary for their work. I promise that...
Viscount Eccles | 677 c1112-3 (Link to this contribution)
I rather doubt whether we will get to the bottom of this subject while considering one Bill in this ...
Baroness Young of Old Scone | 677 c1109-10 (Link to this contribution)
For the benefit of the House, I reassure the noble Baroness, Lady O’Cathain, that this is not a hein...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1114 (Link to this contribution)
My noble friend is right. If I accepted the argument of the noble Earl, Lord Peel, that people shoul...
Lord Carter | 677 c1113-4 (Link to this contribution)
My noble friend might find this helpful. We are missing the point. We are assuming that the board me...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1114 (Link to this contribution)
Please may I finish my sentence? Even on that basis, some people who could make a contribution to th...
Earl Peel | 677 c1113 (Link to this contribution)
The noble Baroness, Lady Farrington, suggested that the payment of a pension was a form of compensat...
Lord Brooke of Sutton Mandeville | 677 c1113 (Link to this contribution)
I apologise for intervening when the Minister sat down after her preliminary response. I was minded ...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1113 (Link to this contribution)
I have not finished replying and there have been many interventions.
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1113 (Link to this contribution)
I thank the noble Viscount, Lord Eccles, deeply for his contribution. I did not intend to interrupt ...
Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer | 677 c1119 (Link to this contribution)
The noble Duke raised some interesting points, but I will speak to them substantially under my own a...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1118 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 52:
Page 46, line 6, leave out ““applies”” and insert ““can apply””
The noble ...
Baroness Byford | 677 c1117-8 (Link to this contribution)
My point was about the ordinary members of the board, whose commitment is not as big. The provision ...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1117 (Link to this contribution)
I believe that I am right in saying—I will correct it by letter if I am wrong—that the noble Barones...
Baroness Byford | 677 c1117 (Link to this contribution)
I will not detain the Committee, as we have had an enormously long debate—I had not quite anticipate...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1114 (Link to this contribution)
No one saw my presence in this House as a greater honour than I did. I am also aware that other peop...
Lord Cameron of Dillington | 677 c1114-5 (Link to this contribution)
I confirm what the noble Lord, Lord Carter, said. I declare an interest as a former chairman of the ...
Lord Rotherwick | 677 c1114 (Link to this contribution)
I am grateful to the noble Baroness, but she makes my point very well herself. People in this House ...
Lord Carter | 677 c1121 (Link to this contribution)
Before the Minister replies, surely we should also look at subsection (2). If we look at what the ge...
Lord Bach | 677 c1121 (Link to this contribution)
I agree with that last contribution. That is as true of subsection (2)(e) as it is of subsections (2...
Viscount Eccles | 677 c1121 (Link to this contribution)
Will the Minister provide us with a definition of ““sustainable development””?
Lord Bach | 677 c1121 (Link to this contribution)
If the noble Viscount will be patient, I will do that. I have an excellent definition from the philo...
Lord Tyler | 677 c1121 (Link to this contribution)
During the passage of the Commons Bill, the Minister resisted all attempts to develop a definition o...
Lord Bach | 677 c1121-2 (Link to this contribution)
Sometimes one has to make diplomatic choices, as I think the noble Lord will know. If I remember rig...
Viscount Bledisloe | 677 c1120 (Link to this contribution)
Let us suppose one has something which will make an enormous contribution to sustainable development...
Lord Bach | 677 c1119-20 (Link to this contribution)
This is the first amendment under Clause 2 and so perhaps I may say some general words about our app...
Viscount Bledisloe | 677 c1121 (Link to this contribution)
With respect, the Minister has missed my point. If the only reference to sustainable development is ...
Lord Bach | 677 c1120-1 (Link to this contribution)
The noble Viscount makes an important point, which I suspect we will be discussing in some detail wh...
Baroness Byford | 677 c1127 (Link to this contribution)
I thank my noble friend for raising these two important amendments. All the amendments following the...
Lord Bach | 677 c1127-9 (Link to this contribution)
I join in thanking the noble Lord, Lord Dixon-Smith, for instigating this interesting debate about v...
Lord Rotherwick | 677 c1125-6 (Link to this contribution)
I have great sympathy with the amendment of my noble friend Lord Dixon-Smith. I am not totally attra...
Lord Carter | 677 c1126-7 (Link to this contribution)
I just say a word about the amendment in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Dixon-Smith. On this debat...
Baroness Byford | 677 c1129 (Link to this contribution)
Before my noble friend returns to the matter, I understand that the Rural Development Service, as pa...
Duke of Montrose | 677 c1122 (Link to this contribution)
We have triggered a rather interesting little debate. I thank all those who have contributed. In par...
Lord Judd | 677 c1125 (Link to this contribution)
I too would like to put on record my appreciation for the immensely significant strategic points abo...
Earl Peel | 677 c1124-5 (Link to this contribution)
Perhaps I may briefly say how much I appreciated the amendment of my noble friend Lord Dixon-Smith b...
Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer | 677 c1124 (Link to this contribution)
I shall resist the temptation offered by the noble Lord to get into climate change. Getting the duti...
Lord Dixon-Smith | 677 c1122-4 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 106:"Page 2, line 5, after ““enhanced”” insert ““, developed””"
The noble Lord ...
Lord Dixon-Smith | 677 c1131 (Link to this contribution)
I am most grateful. With that, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.
Amendment, by leave, withdraw...
Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer | 677 c1131-2 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 107:"Page 2, line 6, leave out ““, thereby contributing to sustainable developme...
Viscount Bledisloe | 677 c1132-3 (Link to this contribution)
I am convinced that the solution proposed by the noble Baroness, Lady Miller—that of removing the re...
Lord Dixon-Smith | 677 c1133 (Link to this contribution)
I support the noble Baroness in her amendment. I do not need to go over the ground because I have ma...
Lord Bach | 677 c1130 (Link to this contribution)
Of course, Natural England’s opinion would be of great importance, but there are legal procedures fo...
Lord Bach | 677 c1131 (Link to this contribution)
I never refuse discussions with the noble Lord.
Lord Dixon-Smith | 677 c1130-1 (Link to this contribution)
I am most grateful to everyone who has taken part in the debate. I am grateful for the general suppo...
Lord Bach | 677 c1130 (Link to this contribution)
I would like to think that I could answer the noble Viscount’s conundrum, but I am not sure that I c...
Viscount Ullswater | 677 c1129-30 (Link to this contribution)
Before the Minister answers, there is one issue that needs to be tackled. The Government have a rene...
Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer | 677 c1142 (Link to this contribution)
I thank all noble Lords who have spoken in this debate, especially the noble Viscount, Lord Bridgema...
Lord Bach | 677 c1139-42 (Link to this contribution)
I shall be as quick as I can. This has been an important and interesting debate and, even though I c...
Duke of Montrose | 677 c1142 (Link to this contribution)
: There is one point that I would like to put to the Minister. The purposes that are outlined there ...
Lord Jopling | 677 c1138-9 (Link to this contribution)
I was struck by one short comment by the noble Lord, Lord Cameron; he said that he thought that Clau...
Lord Carter | 677 c1137-8 (Link to this contribution)
Although I have added my name to Amendment No. 119, I think we have got it wrong. In Amendment No. 1...
Duke of Montrose | 677 c1137 (Link to this contribution)
I speak now to the amendment standing in the name of my noble friend Lady Byford and myself. One can...
Lord Judd | 677 c1136-7 (Link to this contribution)
I declare an interest as the vice-president of the Council for National Parks and the president of t...
Earl Peel | 677 c1135-6 (Link to this contribution)
I support the amendment of the noble Lord, Lord Cameron, to which my name is added. As I said at Sec...
Lord Cameron of Dillington | 677 c1133-5 (Link to this contribution)
In speaking to my Amendment No. 119, I should like to emphasise first that I totally support the vie...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1142 (Link to this contribution)
This may be a convenient moment to break. May I suggest that the Committee stage begin again not bef...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 677 c1115-7 (Link to this contribution)
The noble Lord, Lord Cameron, is right, and I have yet to find an example of any member of a non-dep...
Lord Willoughby de Broke | 677 c1136 (Link to this contribution)
I support the amendment in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Cameron. I declare my interest as a seri...
Duke of Montrose | 677 c1118-9 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 105:"Page 2, line 4, after ““to”” insert—"
““(a)””
The noble Duke said: In...
Viscount Ullswater | 677 c1130 (Link to this contribution)
It does, but I think that that is a given. At any inquiry, Natural England will have to make its min...
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