Health and Social Care Bill (Programme) (No. 4)

I am not going to debate that now. The right hon. Gentleman is going to have to defend himself on whether he has his facts right. I do not think that he has. We need to put firmly on the record that there are real flaws in the Liberal Democrats' proposal. They say that it is a safeguard to state, ““The governors will decide and it is better done at a local level,”” but the governors are going to be under pressure from the management of the hospital because of the pressure on the hospital's finances. If they make a decision that is in the interests of that hospital, it does not mean that it is in the interests of everybody and of NHS patients.