Parliamentary Standards Bill

My Lords, the noble Baroness the Leader of the House has referred to the Constitution Committee. We have all taken its report to the House on these issues very seriously. I must remind her again that it was that committee, in direct response to concerns about the Bill, that asked whether the Bill included a sunset clause as well as any appropriate renewal procedure and, if not, why the Government judged that the inclusion of those things was inappropriate. The committee is on my side in this argument. I am surprised that the noble and learned Lord, Lord Mackay, no longer supports a sunset clause. I think that he has demonstrated—as have many other Members of the House—that when we consider a Bill in full in this House, we like to give it the sort of careful attention that it deserves. That is simply not the case with a statutory instrument. As the noble and learned Lord and many other Members of your Lordships’ House have demonstrated throughout the progress of the Bill, it is when this House is doing its job best that we are so necessary to the process of parliamentary scrutiny. That is why I think that, having accepted the need for scrutiny, as the Government have, many Members on all sides of the House will accept that our suggestion is more appropriate. I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Strathclyde, and not only for his support last week. I can forgive him for reading the Daily Telegraph, although I am not sure why anybody still does. He has pointed out again this evening that there may well be a necessity for new primary legislation. If there is such a necessity, the trigger for it must, of course, be a sunset clause. I hope that the noble Lord and his colleagues on the Conservative Benches will again support us on that. He has emphasised the point that, throughout the process in your Lordships’ House, we have had to look very carefully at a lot of the detail and much of it is still not clear, as was demonstrated by the noble and learned Baroness the Attorney-General. There is no direct impact on IPSA from our sunset clause, any more than there is from the Government’s Clause 13. There is some impact on the commissioner, but IPSA can do its job, knowing that it will have a continuing role. The noble Baroness the Leader of the House referred to being in uncharted waters. Yes, we are, and it would be wholly wrong simply to leave hanging in the air whether there will be a full-scale review of the Bill. If everything in the whole scheme introduced by this legislation is moving very effectively, is well accepted, has credibility and has the confidence of Parliament and the public, the Government of the day can of course introduce a one-clause Bill to remove the sunrise—or, rather, the sunset—clause. They will not need to do any more. Indeed, in a sense this will create a sunrise clause. If the noble Baroness the Leader of the House is so confident that everything is perfect now, what does she have to fear from this amendment? I wish to test the opinion of the House. Division on Amendment 16 Contents 60; Not-Contents 139. [The name of a noble Lord who voted in both Lobbies has been removed from the voting lists.] Amendment 16 disagreed.