Parliamentary Standards Bill

In moving Amendment 80, I shall refer also to government Amendments 82B and 83B. At Second Reading, we all recognised that the Leader of the House was in some difficulty when dealing with a great many questions put all at once at some speed. However, she dealt with the points that were being raised on all sides of the House with admirable clarity and in a most responsive way. At col. 746, she said: ""I recognise however that some clauses could, and perhaps should, be revisited in a period of perhaps two years. I therefore suggest that we come back to this in Committee, but I do not think the Government would be opposed to reviewing some aspects of the Bill in a couple of years".—[Official Report, 8/7/09; cols. 746-47.]" That is precisely the nature of Amendment 80, which sets out in simple and straightforward terms that there should be in effect a sunset clause as follows: ""Sections 5 to 9 shall cease to have effect at the end of the period of two years beginning with the day on which this Act is passed"." There was also a great deal of discussion in the other place about the possibility of, and indeed the necessity for, some form of sunset clause. In the debate on Third Reading on 1 July, at cols. 401-08, Members on all sides expressed anxiety that a Bill of this sort, which is very complicated and raises important questions but is necessarily being considered at speed—though in somewhat more of a hurry in that place than in your Lordships’ House—there should be some form of sunset or review process built into the Bill itself. Members on all sides pressed that there should be a sunset clause or something similar. In resisting that, Mr Jack Straw had two strong arguments. The first was that the amendment put before the House was for only one year, and there was a general recognition that that was perhaps asking too much. The other was that the amendment referred to the whole Bill. I want to make it absolutely clear to noble Lords that the amendment before the Committee today does not ask for a sunset clause for the whole Bill, so that IPSA and the new regime being introduced would not be subjected to automatic abolition after a relatively short period. That objection therefore clearly falls. Our amendment refers precisely to the specific clauses that are generally recognised on all sides to have merit, possibly, but also to be controversial and to have been considered at relative speed. Before us today we have two alternative approaches to the agreed requirement for a specific assessment of the whole package introduced by this Bill within two years, to which the noble Baroness referred at Second Reading. The choice is between a full-scale sunset clause, as in Amendment 80, and a renewal clause, which is a totally different matter; it would mean the simple introduction of a statutory instrument in both Houses under the new amendments very recently tabled by the noble Baroness—indeed, we are seeing them for the first time today. At this point, and in common with many other Members of the Committee, I should pay tribute to the way in which the Leader of the House has listened so carefully to the prevailing anxieties and positive suggestions from all sides. I warmly welcome her apparent conversion to the principle of review or a sunset clause for Sections 5 to 9 and Schedule 2. However, it is important that the Committee should investigate fully the differences between these two approaches before deciding how best to build in the necessary safeguards that all sides now think are required. There has scarcely been a contribution to the debate in either House that has not referred to the lightning speed with which we have considered and continue to consider this Bill. I am not a meteorologist, but in this instance I think that the sunset is as necessary as the lightning that we have already had to experience. I have looked briefly at past examples of important Bills introduced at speed in response to some form of emergency to check the extent to which a review has or has not proved as satisfactory as a sunset clause. My attention was drawn to the Prevention of Terrorism Bill—now an Act—which was debated at length in the other place on 10 March 2005. I take seriously the comments made by Mr Dominic Grieve on that occasion. I must have been there because I certainly remember that we had considerable discussion about the best way of ensuring that a Bill passed at some speed would be reviewed within a specific timescale. Mr Grieve was admirably succinct and what he said is very relevant. He said: ""The situation regarding the sunset clause is quite clear. The Government know from the comments of many of their Back Benchers, including those whom they persuaded to support them yesterday, that the Bill is without doubt a major infringement of civil liberties and is poorly drafted. The hon. and learned Member for Redcar … made that comment, even though, in her loyalty, she came back to support the Government. The Home Secretary should therefore accept that the legislation should have a finite limit. Without such a limit, I have no confidence that the Government will ever review the measure properly. We will simply be asked to rubber-stamp its renewal, and there will be no creative thinking about how we resolve our present dilemma and maintain civil liberties while fighting terrorism adequately".—[Official Report, Commons, 10/3/05; cols. 1767-68.]" We all accept that occasionally it is necessary for both Houses of Parliament to pass important legislation at some speed, but we have always insisted in the past that that speed is measured when it comes to considering a review. The Government’s response throughout the Committee stage has demonstrated just how seriously criticisms and concerns have been taken, but none of the changes that have been made completely clears the need for the Bill, when it eventually reaches the statute book, to be subjected to rigorous and detailed re-examination after it has been in operation for a limited time. After a good many years of seeing in what fashion both Houses consider secondary legislation, my concern is that the process proposed in the Government’s amendments could easily become perfunctory. Just as serious, it might turn into an all-or-nothing confrontation rather than a careful consideration of all the different parts of the process for which we are now legislating. In addition, as we are all now only too well aware, a great deal of the architecture, which is a word that has been used on a number of occasions by the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, for this new scheme will be developed at a secondary level—it is not all in place today—without the full scrutiny that we give to a Bill. That detail will follow on. That surely strengthens the case for a review process that is stronger than that available simply in a statutory instrument. A political problem could arise if this is simply left to secondary legislation. Given the stark choice between accepting and rejecting a parliamentary standards statutory instrument in 2011, Members of both Houses may well feel inhibited and not prepared to seek detailed improvements to the way in which the new system is operating. Worse still, with no obvious improved system to replace it, how could they feel comfortable in voting against that order? We have had a little over two weeks to consider the Bill. In two years, the House of Commons will look different—who knows how?—and the effectiveness of the new independent authority will have been assessed and commented on at length. Then will surely be the time for another Bill, taken on the basis of firm facts. Reflecting on evidence and not just responding to news, we will have an idea of how well all the elements of the present Bill, enacted, have or have not worked. I am sure that the Leader of the House will appreciate that her important amendments have come to us only very recently. Although all Members of the Committee no doubt appreciate that we have received them now rather than on Report after the weekend, we surely need a little more time to consider them carefully and consult on their implications. Obviously we will all listen with great care to the Minister to try to fully understand precisely how the Government think their alternatives could work. In the mean time, at first sight—and we have had so little time to examine these proposals—I am not persuaded that the limited review process suggested is a sufficient, realistic and satisfactory alternative to the sunset clause that we propose. Finally, I pray in aid the excellent reports produced by your Lordships’ Constitution Committee. In an appendix to the report on the Parliamentary Standards Bill published on 6 July, the committee drew our attention to the particular needs of any Bill that receives any kind of fast-track process through your Lordships’ House. In the recommendations contained in the Constitution Committee’s report, Fast-track Legislation: Constitutional Implications and Safeguards, at paragraph 186(e) the committee advises your Lordships’ House very precisely that this is the kind of question that we should ask: ""Does the bill include a sunset clause (as well as any appropriate renewal procedure)? If not, why do the Government judge that their inclusion is not appropriate?"." That is a proper question to ask. I beg to move.