Borders, Citizenship and Immigration Bill [HL]

We share the ultimate objective proposed by the noble Baroness of a unified border force, but our attitude to the Bill is somewhat different. We look at the crossing between UKBA and HMRC as an important step towards the ultimate goal that we share with the noble Baroness, so we welcome the intention behind Part 1 of allowing immigration officers and officials of the Secretary of State to exercise revenue and customs functions. As she implied, the lines of this debate are bound to follow those of the one that we had on similar amendments to the UK Borders Bill in 2007 at both Committee and Report stages. I do not intend to repeat the arguments that were used on both those occasions; I just want to highlight the differences between our ideas and those of the Tories, which have not changed substantially since that occasion. The Liberal Democrats’ policy is that an integrated borders force would cover the border functions of the police as well as the functions of the UKBA and HMRC, whereas the functions of what the Conservatives describe as a UK border police force would extend to a range of other matters, including the detection and removal of illegal overstayers and the investigation of employers of illegal immigrants. The suggestion that the border force be given these functions, which are essentially part of the normal duties of the police—although they may require close liaison with UKBA and possibly others on the same lines as a result of the order-making power proposed in the Conservative amendments—indicates some confusion in Tory thinking about where the boundaries of the United Kingdom are located. We maintain that the arguments in the Home Affairs Select Committee report HC 163, which was published in January 2001, for including the police in a force whose activities are confined to the borders are still valid. The report highlighted the ways in which the division of responsibilities at the ports foster inefficiencies, because the UKBA, HMRC and the police operate in slightly different ways, depending on the skills of their staff, their objectives and priorities, their equipment, their facilities and their legal basis. The report says, for example, that although larger ports such as Dover have Customs, immigration and police on duty, at the smaller ports there may only be a single police officer whose powers as an examining officer are confined to those in Schedule 7 to the Terrorism Act 2000. Those powers may be extended to an immigration or customs officer. The police do not have reciprocal powers, however, under the relevant immigration and customs legislation. Nevertheless, we are realistic about the prospects for dealing with this in the current Bill for two reasons. First, there would need to be full consultation with the Scottish Parliament, which has authority over policing in Scotland and thus at the UK’s borders in Scotland. Secondly, although the noble Baroness has cited the report of the noble Lord, Lord Stevens, we have not consulted ACPO or the Association of Police Authorities, which would need to be given details of how the police at the borders would fully exchange roles with the UKBA and HMRC so that they could make useful suggestions in that regard. In 2007, the noble Lord, Lord Bassam, told your Lordships that ACPO was uncertain about the benefits of the single agency. However, we know that it has given the matter further thought since then. Could the Minister bring us up to date on ACPO’s thinking and on any discussions that the Government have had with ACPO on Part 1 in particular? Can he at least tell us how the police at the borders can work more closely with HMRC and UKBA under existing legislation and whether the Government have any further thoughts on how to overcome the problems that were identified by the Home Affairs Select Committee before we get to the ultimate ideal of a unified border force?