Police and Justice Bill

My Lords, I understand the anxieties and I hope that I shall be able to lay them to rest. I should say in passing that often things are considered by others—for example, police chiefs—and suggestions are made which the press may or may not get into the public domain and which may or may not have come before others. It is very important for us to look at what is before us. Everyone believes—that is why the noble Baroness was not worried about it—that the penalty notice for disorder scheme is currently being used to excellent effect by the police and the wider police family, such as community support officers and persons accredited under the community safety accreditation schemes. The use of fixed penalty notices to tackle nuisance and anti-social offending in local communities has proved very successful. If, like me, the noble Baroness has spoken to a number of area officers, she will know that they see this as one of the most effective ways that we have yet been able to devise of changing anti-social behaviour in an area. Punishment can be administered on the spot, driving home the Government’s message that such behaviour is unacceptable. We believe that it is right to deal with simple, straightforward cases in this prompt and effective way, reserving the courts for disputed and more complex cases. I know that that is something about which the noble Baroness and her party have agreed in the past. Clause 14 specifically extends the range of those who may be accredited to issue penalty notices for disorder to trading standards officers. I am very grateful for the noble Lord’s indication that he is comfortable with any such extension. We believe that there are other such classes of enforcement officer to whom it may prove similarly advantageous to give the power to issue notices in this way and thus widen the scope of the fixed penalty notice scheme. The PND scheme will help to deliver the aims of the Government’s respect agenda to tackle anti-social and nuisance behaviour in local communities. As noble Lords may know, numerous safeguards are attached to the use of this power. First, it will be subject to the affirmative resolution procedure. Parliament will be able to debate the issues fully before voting on the extension of accreditation to another class of people. Secondly, as with trading standards officers, accreditation is under the control of the chief officers of police. Thirdly, the only penalty offences that our new class of accredited person would be able to enforce would be those specified in their accreditation, so it would be strictly controlled. We believe that this power will be a helpful tool in enabling penalty notices for disorder to be used by the wider police family for more cases of minor nuisance offending. For those reasons, I hope that the noble Lord will be prepared to withdraw his amendment. I shall deal with some of the issues raised by the noble Baroness, Lady Anelay. She said that she was surprised that Ministers were not consulted. I say to her that the press account was not entirely accurate. I was given to understand that most of the proposals alluded to came from police chiefs. My right honourable friend the Home Secretary will not approve any lessening of punishment for violent crime. It is not proposed that the list of offences should be extended to include, for example, robbery, mugging or other serious offences. I understand the anxiety that has been raised by such speculation, but I assure the noble Baroness that her first response to these amendments was correct and any excitement caused outside this House can be left there. We are looking at the most proportionate and effective way of dealing with a problem which is common to all. It is interesting how our joint positions have developed. I think that both the Liberal Democrats and Her Majesty’s loyal Opposition now agree with us that anti-social behaviour is a matter that we can address effectively and that penalty notices for disorder are an appropriate way forward. I hope that the noble Lord will feel content with that response and that he will not press his amendment.