Natural Environment and Rural Communities Bill

moved Amendment No. 235:"Page 49, line 11, leave out ““pensions,””" The noble Baroness said: We return yet again to pensions. I am grateful to the Minister for writing to me following our previous discussion and I shall explain why I wish to return to the subject. I understand that board members of the commission will be appointed by the Secretary of State and may be paid"““such remuneration and allowances as the Secretary of State may determine””." The commission must also pay towards the provision of pensions, gratuities and allowances. That provision will presumably take effect at the end of each member’s service, or when he or she reaches pensionable age. Why is there a need to pay a pension to those who are still serving members? If there is, on what basis will it be calculated? The Bill makes the same provision for the payment of pensions to the employees of the commission as it does to board members. It also sets the same proviso for the payments towards the future pension provision for employees. When we debated pensions in relation to Natural England, I was assured that the provision applied only to the board chairman and possibly the deputy chairman. I cannot accept that that is the case when in several places in the Bill the same provisions appear covering the whole board and sometimes the employees as well. The letter that I received from the Minister states:"““Where a significant time commitment is required, it is often only feasible for such people to serve as board members if they are fairly remunerated for their services. An appropriate package may in these circumstances need to include pension arrangements. Such arrangements will, needless to say, only be made where they can demonstrate sound value for money. Typically, it will only be the chair, or deputy chair, of a board who falls into this category, but that may not always be the case.""In establishing a new body, it is therefore standard practice to insert a clause taking powers to make pension arrangements for board members.""In practice, the decision by the Secretary of State to approve pension arrangements for a board member will be a matter of discretion””." My question, following that response, has to be: when is that decided? Is it decided when the person is interviewed and being considered as a board member? Is it part of the remit of the Secretary of State or the interview panel to discuss it with the person putting himself forward as a board member? Or is it decided afterwards when a board member has been appointed? It is not clear. The letter continues:"““A situation might arise when another Board member was invited to work for more than the usual 2–3 days/month and there should be discretion to consider the pension issue””." I am concerned about pensions and who is entitled to them. Will the existing pension of somebody who goes on to be a board member be taken up by the department, or is a pension to be part of the payment package? Perhaps the remuneration is considered not enough, which is why the pension scheme is being imposed. I am sorry to return to the issue, but I find it very perplexing. I beg to move.