Identity Cards Bill

I think I see where my noble friend Lady Anelay and the noble Lord, Lord Phillips of Sudbury, are coming from. As I understand it, they are coming from slightly different positions. My noble friend Lady Anelay wants the Bill to be clear and to result in an effective and efficient form of identity card. She perhaps feels that it would be premature to have a facility for measures that technically are not yet fully available for use. The noble Lord, Lord Phillips of Sudbury, and indeed his party, is probably fairly deeply sceptical about the wisdom of allowing the state to introduce identity cards at all. As the Minister knows, I come from the position that the time has come for the state, with the multitude of dealings that it has with individuals, to be absolutely clear about who people are. I have always thought that the card will be a terrible distraction. I would prefer a central register of data on people, forgetting the card, which has many emotional implications. However, I have great sympathy with my noble friend Lord Lucas. If the object of the exercise is to have a really clear way of identifying people, we want the best biometrics that are available. I am prepared to believe that DNA is not yet sufficiently reliable, particularly in examples of taking it from moisture left by fingerprints, to allow its use. The arrival of the moment when it can be used should be very publicly known. I therefore believe that it should be introduced in some form of supplementary legislation when that time comes. For those reasons, I support my noble friend in saying that I would rather like it not to be included in the Bill. On the other hand, I very much feel that the more biometrics you have, simply by the definition of map finding, if you cross several lines, you will be more certain about where you are if they all cross at the same point. Although we have facial recognition, fingerprints and possibly iris recognition, DNA will undoubtedly constitute a huge step forward as regards certainty in knowing who people are. I do not want to see the possibility of it being excluded in the long run; although it would be a good idea to exclude that possibility from the Bill.