My Lords, I am afraid I must start by disappointing the noble and learned Lord, Lord Garnier: I have not been discouraged from pursuing the point that a number of noble Lords have made in this debate. I strongly support my noble and learned friend Lord Falconer’s amendments. I do so for all the reasons that have been given about the need for scrutiny, questioning and elaboration. Because a number of other noble Lords have made those points, I will not make them again, other than to say that they seem to me to have considerable force.
Like the noble Lord, Lord Bhatia, I am not a lawyer, but I share with my noble friend Lord Hain the honour of having been a Foreign Office Minister. One of the things that was in my portfolio was the consular service. I know in practice from the responsibilities that the consular service laid on me that, particularly where there were criminal cases or the kinds of cases that the noble Lord, Lord Bhatia, has mentioned, which touch on people considerably because they have to do with marriage, children and so on, there was a huge expectation on the part of UK citizens that the Foreign Office would be able to offer them competent advice and help through the consular service. Frequently, in order to work out what was needed, we found that we also, although not lawyers, turned to the Lord Chancellor’s advisory committee. We tried to make sure that we had a very strong sense of what was and what was not possible, and from that we could work out what sort of help we could—or, sadly, on some occasions could not—provide to British citizens.
The biggest liability for British citizens was of course that, as in many cases in domestic law, they were not absolutely clear about what the law was or what it might imply for them. They could see nothing of considerable relevance to go back to in the debates there had been about it. Indeed, they probably did not even go back to those debates very frequently, but nor could we—the people who were trying to work out what should be provided through the service.
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I think that makes the case for these amendments, probing or not, compelling. In Amendment 20(2)(c) there is provision for other persons or organisations representing various interests that might substantially be affected by the proposals. There is a mechanism for
consulting those bodies. I do not think it is a matter for consultation only among the legal parts of the state but among all those who have to try to make sense of it for British citizens when they find themselves in trouble. You want the maximum guidance possible and therefore maximum visibility of what has been decided. Henry VIII powers do not generally do that so I say, with great respect, to the noble and learned Lord, Lord Garnier, that we may all find ourselves arguing for these things in particular cases but the reality is that it needs to be in a clear, accessible and visible form if we are to really help people who fall into difficulty with these laws. In my view, there is an obligation to help them. Private international law is not much discussed. It does not help them at all. We are duty bound to do so.