Lords report stage (third day). Clauses 137-138, 141-142, 144, 146, 153-154, 159, 167, 173-174, 177-178, 180, 182, 186-188, 191, 194, 196-198, 200, 202-203, 228, 232-233, 238-240, 242, 246-247 and Schedules 8-10, amendments agreed to. Clause 147, amendment disagreed to on division (82 to 321). New clauses agreed to.
Investigatory Powers Bill
About these Parliamentary proceedings
Reference
774 cc2346-2422Session
2016-17Legislative stage
Report stageChamber / Committee
House of Lords chamberRelated items
Investigatory Powers Bill 2015-16 to 2016-17. As amended in Committee.
Monday, 12 September 2016
Bills
House of Lords
Monday, 12 September 2016
Bills
House of Lords
Proceeding contributions
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 c2346 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Keen of Elie
180: Clause 137, page 110, line 4, leave out subsection (6...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 cc2346-7 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, Amendments 180, 181, 197, 198, 205, 206, 231 and 232 relate to judicial commissioner ap...
Show all contributions (145)
Baroness Hayter of Kentish Town | 774 cc2347-8 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I thank the Minister for moving these amendments, all of which we are happy to support ...
Baroness Hamwee | 774 c2348 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we, too, are happy with the government amendments in this group and we support Amendmen...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 cc2348-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, as the noble Baroness, Lady Hayter, has observed, Amendment 185A would remove the Secre...
Earl Howe | 774 c2349 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
181: After Clause 137, insert the following new Clause—
“App...
Earl Howe | 774 c2349 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
182: Clause 138, page 111, line 6, leave out “fifth” and insert “t...
Earl Howe | 774 c2349 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
184: Clause 141, page 113, line 41, after “(5)” insert “and sectio...
Earl Howe | 774 c2349 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
185: Clause 142, page 114, line 21, after “(5)” insert “and sectio...
Earl Howe | 774 c2351 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
186: Clause 144, page 116, line 26, at end insert—
“( ) In d...
Earl Howe | 774 c2351 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
187: Clause 144, page 116, line 34, at end insert—
“( ) For ...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2351-2 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
189: Clause 144, page 116, line 34, at end insert—
“(3A) Sub...
Earl Howe | 774 c2352 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
191: Clause 144, page 116, line 40, at end insert—
“(4A) The...
Earl Howe | 774 c2352 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
194: After Clause 144, insert the following new Clause—
“Add...
Lord Janvrin | 774 cc2352-3 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Janvrin
195: After Clause 144, insert the following new Clause—
“...
Earl Howe | 774 c2353 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
196: Clause 146, page 117, line 21, at end insert—
“section ...
Lord Paddick | 774 c2353 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Paddick
196A: Clause 147, page 118, line 48, at end insert—
“( ) ...
Lord Paddick | 774 cc2353-4 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, Amendment 196A is in my name and that of my noble friend Lady Hamwee. It seeks to remov...
Lord Harris of Haringey | 774 c2354 (Link to this contribution)
Surely Section 44 was for target hardening and deterrence rather than for any other purpose.
Lord Paddick | 774 cc2354-5 (Link to this contribution)
I am very grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Harris, but that is not what I understood Parliament’s...
Lord Carlile of Berriew | 774 cc2355-6 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, it will not surprise my noble friend to learn that I oppose the amendment that he has j...
Lord Paddick | 774 c2356 (Link to this contribution)
The amendment relates specifically to internet connection records being acquired, and I have yet ...
Lord Carlile of Berriew | 774 cc2356-7 (Link to this contribution)
If my noble friend wants me to be specific, I will, but I was trying not to take up too much time...
Lord Rooker | 774 c2357 (Link to this contribution)
I will answer that point. The Bill of course is not draconian in any way whatever. It is a modest...
Lord Campbell of Pittenweem | 774 cc2357-8 (Link to this contribution)
I can be brief. I must begin of course by expressing my regret that I do not agree with my noble ...
Lord Oates | 774 c2358 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I support my noble friend Lord Paddick and the amendment that he has moved. I should sa...
Lord Carlile of Berriew | 774 cc2358-9 (Link to this contribution)
My noble friend is playing with language. I have never favoured the recording of every website us...
Lord Oates | 774 c2359 (Link to this contribution)
I am dealing with the fact that we are granting a power under the Bill, as this House voted only ...
Lord King of Bridgwater | 774 c2359 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I think the noble Lord accepts one thing: the use of these powers, which are very subst...
Lord Oates | 774 c2359 (Link to this contribution)
The noble Lord asks me specifically what I believe. It is very simple. I do not believe that we s...
Lord King of Bridgwater | 774 cc2360-1 (Link to this contribution)
So the noble Lord does not agree with David Anderson or with those who said that this could be an...
Bishop of Chester | 774 c2361 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am sure we do not want to prolong this debate. As I said on Monday, I was a member of...
Baroness Harding of Winscombe | 774 c2361 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I fear that we are repeating the debate we had the day before yesterday. If noble Lords...
Lord Rosser | 774 cc2361-2 (Link to this contribution)
As the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, said, David Anderson QC commented in his report that neither the...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 cc2362-3 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, this amendment would remove the ability for the intelligence agencies to acquire intern...
Lord Paddick | 774 c2363 (Link to this contribution)
I am grateful to the Minister and to other noble Lords who have contributed to this debate. As re...
Lord Rooker | 774 c2363 (Link to this contribution)
For the avoidance of doubt, I understood that—that was the point I made.
Lord Paddick | 774 cc2363-4 (Link to this contribution)
I did not suggest in any way that David Anderson agreed with this amendment, or that the lists of...
Lord King of Bridgwater | 774 c2364 (Link to this contribution)
Will the noble Lord—
Lord Paddick | 774 c2364 (Link to this contribution)
I am sorry but this is Report and I do not have to give way, unless the noble Lord wishes to clar...
Lord King of Bridgwater | 774 c2364 (Link to this contribution)
I wish to make an intervention. The noble Lord said again that nobody wants this power. Can he ex...
Lord Paddick | 774 c2364 (Link to this contribution)
It is not for me to explain why the Government want in the Bill a power that currently does not e...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2364-8 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
197: Clause 153, page 122, line 17, leave out subsection (6)
Earl Howe | 774 c2368 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
199: Clause 154, page 123, line 15, leave out “fifth” and insert “...
Earl Howe | 774 c2368 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
201: Clause 159, page 127, line 10, after “(5)” insert “and sectio...
Lord Butler of Brockwell | 774 cc2368-9 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Butler of Brockwell
203: After Clause 160, insert the following new Cla...
Lord Paddick | 774 c2369 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Paddick
203A: Clause 163, leave out Clause 163
Lord Paddick | 774 cc2369-2370 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the amendment is in my name and that of my noble friend Lady Hamwee. I shall speak also...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2370-2 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, these amendments would remove the bulk equipment interference provisions from the Bill....
Lord Paddick | 774 c2372 (Link to this contribution)
I am grateful to the Minister for his comments. He kept saying that this power to conduct bulk eq...
Earl Howe | 774 c2373 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
204: Clause 167, page 132, line 37, leave out “(unless already can...
Earl Howe | 774 c2373 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
205: Clause 173, page 137, line 10, leave out subsection (7)
Earl Howe | 774 cc2373-4 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
206: After Clause 173, insert the following new Clause—
“App...
Earl Howe | 774 c2374 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
207: Clause 174, page 138, line 13, leave out “fifth” and insert “...
Earl Howe | 774 c2374 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
209: Clause 177, page 141, line 4, after “(5)” insert “and section...
Earl Howe | 774 c2375 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
210: Clause 178, page 141, line 28, after “(5)” insert “and sectio...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2375-6 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
211: Clause 180, page 143, line 29, at end insert—
“( ) In d...
Earl Howe | 774 c2376 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
216: After Clause 180, insert the following new Clause—
“Add...
Lord Butler of Brockwell | 774 cc2376-7 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Butler of Brockwell
217: After Clause 180, insert the following new Cla...
Earl Howe | 774 c2377 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
218: Clause 182, page 144, line 28, at end insert—
“section ...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 c2377 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Keen of Elie
219: Clause 186, page 145, line 36, at end insert—
“...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 cc2378-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, this group contains a number of amendments specific to Part 7 of the Bill, which covers...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 cc2379-2380 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Keen of Elie
220: After Clause 186, insert the following new Clause—
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 c2380 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Keen of Elie
221: Clause 187, page 146, line 21, leave out from “servic...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 c2380 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Keen of Elie
222: Clause 188, page 147, line 13, leave out “wishes” and...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 c2380 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Keen of Elie
227: After Clause 189, insert the following new Clause—
Earl Howe | 774 c2381 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe:
228: Clause 191, page 150, line 19, at end insert—
“and sec...
Earl Howe | 774 c2381 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe:
229: Clause 194, page 152, line 9, at end insert “, and
(d)...
Earl Howe | 774 c2381 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe:
230: Clause 196, page 154, line 3, at end insert—
“( ) Sect...
Earl Howe | 774 c2381 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe:
231: Clause 197, page 154, line 37, leave out subsection (6)
Earl Howe | 774 cc2381-2 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe:
232: After Clause 197, insert the following new Clause—
“Ap...
Earl Howe | 774 c2382 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe:
233: Clause 198, page 155, line 33, leave out “fifth” and insert ...
Earl Howe | 774 c2382 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe:
235: Clause 200, page 157, line 7, at end insert—
“( ) In d...
Earl Howe | 774 c2382 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe:
236: Clause 202, page 159, line 9, after “that” insert “arrangeme...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2383-4 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe:
239: After Clause 202, insert the following new Clause—
“Ad...
Lord Janvrin | 774 cc2384-5 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Janvrin
241: After Clause 202, insert the following new Clause—
“...
Earl Howe | 774 c2385 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe:
242: Clause 203, page 160, line 11, at end insert—
“( ) In ...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 c2386 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Keen of Elie
243: Schedule 8, page 242, line 7, at end insert—
“(...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 cc2386-8 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I will now address government amendments relating to definitions and extent, and conseq...
Lord Low of Dalston | 774 cc2388-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I shall speak to Amendments 294 and 295, tabled by the noble Baronesses, Lady Hollins a...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 c2389 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we discussed the substantive points on this issue on day one of Report. We consider the...
Baroness Hamwee | 774 c2389 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Hamwee
244: Clause 225, page 178, line 12, leave out from “receive”...
Baroness Hamwee | 774 c2389 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I shall also speak to Amendments 245 and 246. These amendments take us back to the ques...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2389-2391 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, Amendments 244 and 245 are intended to ensure that communications service providers are...
Baroness Hamwee | 774 c2391 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, until the last two or three sentences, I thought the noble Earl had made a much better ...
Earl Howe | 774 c2391 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
247: Clause 228, page 180, line 18, at end insert—
“( ) In a...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2391-3 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I shall speak also to the other government amendments. Government Amendments 247 to 250...
Earl Howe | 774 c2393 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
248: Clause 228, page 180, line 19, leave out from “But” to “to” i...
Lord Paddick | 774 c2393 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Paddick
250A: Clause 229, page 180, line 46, at end insert—
“(c) ...
Lord Paddick | 774 c2393 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, Amendments 250A and 251A, in my name and that of my noble friend Lady Hamwee, relate to...
Lord Rooker | 774 c2394 (Link to this contribution)
Could the noble Lord list the operators to which he referred?
Lord Paddick | 774 c2394 (Link to this contribution)
I can certainly tell the noble Lord that Yahoo! was one of the operators, but I do not have a lis...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2394-5 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, Amendment 250A would define a technical capability notice as,
“specifying the dis...
Lord Beith | 774 c2395 (Link to this contribution)
Before the noble Earl sits down, I refer to a point which at least needs to be borne in mind in d...
Earl Howe | 774 c2395 (Link to this contribution)
With the leave of the House, I am grateful to the noble Lord for raising that point, which I thin...
Lord Paddick | 774 c2395 (Link to this contribution)
I am very grateful to the Minister, particularly for his explanation around Amendment 251A. I com...
Lord Harris of Haringey | 774 c2395 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Harris of Haringey
251: Clause 229, page 181, line 32, at end insert—
Lord Harris of Haringey | 774 cc2395-8 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, noble Lords who have followed my limited contributions to the Bill will know that I tak...
Lord Paddick | 774 cc2398-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I will speak to our Amendments 252 to 254 and the other amendments in this group. To sa...
Lord Strasburger | 774 cc2399-2401 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I shall rise to that opportunity. Amendment 251, in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Ha...
Lord Rooker | 774 cc2401-2 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, if I could be convinced that the same rules applied everywhere on the globe—because we ...
Lord Harris of Haringey | 774 c2402 (Link to this contribution)
Before my noble friend sits down, to be honest I think that he has slightly misunderstood the poi...
Lord Rooker | 774 c2402 (Link to this contribution)
I take on board what my noble friend is saying. I fully accept the distinction he makes but, basi...
Lord Evans of Weardale | 774 c2403 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, there have not been very many points in the course of this legislation on which I have ...
Baroness Hayter of Kentish Town | 774 cc2403-4 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we have had some rather good discussions with the tech companies. In Committee, we put ...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2404-6 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I hope that the House will allow me to speak at somewhat greater length than usual in r...
Lord Beith | 774 c2406 (Link to this contribution)
Could the Minister help those of us who are not deeply technical in these matters? We fear that c...
Earl Howe | 774 c2407 (Link to this contribution)
We come back to the test of reasonable practicability here. I am about to come on to what the Bil...
Lord Harris of Haringey | 774 c2407 (Link to this contribution)
I am very grateful for the detailed exposition that has been given. The Minister says that the Bi...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2407-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, some noble Lords have suggested the Bill’s provisions cause a weakening in encryption, ...
Lord Strasburger | 774 c2409 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, if the noble Earl is so confident that none of the unintended consequences listed in Am...
Earl Howe | 774 c2409 (Link to this contribution)
We already have a wide range of safeguards which I have listed. I do not see that it is necessary...
Lord Harris of Haringey | 774 c2409 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am enormously grateful to the noble Earl for his detailed response and for reiteratin...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2409-2410 (Link to this contribution)
With the leave of the House, I hope I can help the noble Lord on this because I do not believe th...
Lord Harris of Haringey | 774 cc2410-1 (Link to this contribution)
Again I am grateful to the noble Earl. I do not think anyone here has misunderstood the point tha...
Earl Howe | 774 c2411 (Link to this contribution)
I can state categorically to the noble Lord that it is absolutely not the case that the Bill woul...
Lord Harris of Haringey | 774 c2411 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I understand that that is the case; that is, if they have the encryption key—we will no...
Earl Howe | 774 c2411 (Link to this contribution)
Of course, a technical capability notice can require a new capability to be built; that is what t...
Lord Harris of Haringey | 774 cc2411-2 (Link to this contribution)
The Minister reminds us that the ideal arrangement is one of easy interchange and discussion—I un...
Earl Howe | 774 c2412 (Link to this contribution)
That would not be reasonably practicable in that particular example.
Lord Harris of Haringey | 774 c2412 (Link to this contribution)
I accept that it would not be reasonably practicable; it would also be very expensive—as I unders...
Earl Howe | 774 c2412 (Link to this contribution)
I think I have made the Government’s position as clear as I possibly can and I am not sure what I...
Lord Harris of Haringey | 774 c2412 (Link to this contribution)
I understand the Minister’s dilemma and I am sure that a letter from him to me would have far les...
Earl Howe | 774 c2413 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
255: Clause 232, page 184, line 2, leave out “only if” and insert ...
Earl Howe | 774 c2413 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
258: Clause 233, page 185, line 13, after first “section” insert “...
Lord Paddick | 774 c2413 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Paddick
258A: Clause 236, page 186, line 24, after “period,” insert “an...
Lord Paddick | 774 cc2413-4 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I shall also speak to Amendment 258B. The powers in the Bill are significant, as are th...
Lord Rosser | 774 c2414 (Link to this contribution)
There is obviously going to be a desire to know how the Act is operating and the Bill does provid...
Lord Murphy of Torfaen | 774 cc2414-5 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I shall add some points to what my noble friend has just said. During our rather long d...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 c2415 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we remain sympathetic to the desire for ongoing scrutiny of the Bill and this is alread...
Lord Paddick | 774 c2415 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am grateful to the noble and learned Lord for his explanation. We are still of the vi...
Baroness Hamwee | 774 c2416 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Hamwee
258C: Clause 236, page 186, line 28, after “particular” inse...
Baroness Hamwee | 774 cc2416-7 (Link to this contribution)
I apologise to the House both that this is a rather inelegantly presented amendment and that it c...
Lord Keen of Elie | 774 c2417 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, this amendment is unnecessary. The Government have already made it clear that the new I...
Baroness Hamwee | 774 c2417 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I chose the last words of my remarks quite carefully because it is the statutory basis ...
Earl Howe | 774 c2417 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
259: Clause 238, page 189, line 31, after “be” insert “or is capab...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2417-8 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
260: Clause 239, page 191, leave out lines 46 and 47
261: Cl...
Earl Howe | 774 cc2418-9 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
268: After Clause 239, insert the following new Clause—
“Gen...
Earl Howe | 774 c2419 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Earl Howe
269: Clause 240, page 193, line 27, at end insert—