UK Parliament / Open data

Housing and Planning Bill

Lords committee stage fourth day. Amendments discussed. Clauses 8 to 11 agreed. New clause (Lords amendment 54A) debated and withdrawn. Part 1 of 2.

About these Parliamentary proceedings

Reference

769 cc1164-1234 

Session

2015-16

Legislative stage

Committee stage

Procedure

New clauses

Chamber / Committee

House of Lords chamber
Housing and Planning Bill 2015-16. Brought from the Commons
Wednesday, 13 January 2016
Bills
House of Lords
Delegated Powers and Regulatory Reform Committee twentieth report.
Wednesday, 3 February 2016
Parliamentary committees
House of Lords
Deposited Paper DEP2016-0330
Monday, 4 April 2016
Deposited papers
House of Lords
Deposited Paper DEP2016-0380
Tuesday, 19 April 2016
Deposited papers
House of Lords

Proceeding contributions

Lord Beecham | 769 c1164 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Beecham

54: Clause 8, page 5, line 29, at end insert “, and without unr...

Lord Beecham | 769 cc1164-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, we begin further deliberation on this important Bill with what your Lordships will be p...


Show all contributions (112)
Baroness Bakewell of Hardington Mandeville | 769 cc1165-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support the amendment and I hope that I will not disappoint the noble Lord, Lord Beec...

Lord O'Shaughnessy | 769 cc1166-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Beecham, for moving this amendment—not, unfortuna...

Lord Taylor of Goss Moor | 769 cc1168-9 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I want to associate myself with the comments just made and those of others who have spo...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 cc1169-1171 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, we have debated with some intensity in Committee so far the need to build more homes, c...

Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 769 c1171 (Link to this contribution)

Will the noble Viscount say a little more about the point on planning delay made by the noble Lor...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1171 (Link to this contribution)

The noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, makes a good point. I stress that powers to speed up planning are i...

Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 769 c1171 (Link to this contribution)

On that point, I am a member of a planning committee. Most of the planning matters go through und...

Lord O'Shaughnessy | 769 c1171 (Link to this contribution)

I knew that I would run into trouble when I mentioned planning and local authorities, given how m...

Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 769 c1171 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the noble Lord for that. I can see that we are not going to agree on this because I just ...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1172 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, to complete this short debate, I repeat that the issue of planning will come up later o...

Lord Beecham | 769 c1172 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am grateful to all noble Lords who have participated in this debate. I am glad that t...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1172 (Link to this contribution)

I agree with the important points raised by the noble Lord about skills and I will certainly take...

Lord Beecham | 769 c1172 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, that being the case I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.

Baroness Parminter | 769 c1173 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Baroness Parminter

54A: After Clause 11, insert the following new Clause—

Baroness Parminter | 769 cc1173-4 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the Government’s attempt to solve the current housing crisis needs, at the same time, t...

Lord Krebs | 769 cc1174-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support the amendment. I put my name to it because I believe that, as the noble Baron...

Baroness Young of Old Scone | 769 cc1176-7 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am very pleased to join the noble Baroness, Lady Parminter, and the noble Lord, Lord ...

Lord Foster of Bath | 769 cc1177-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, in supporting my noble friend Lady Parminter’s amendment, I echo the words of both the ...

Baroness Whitaker | 769 cc1178-9 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I, too, support the amendment. When the Select Committee, of which I was also a member,...

Baroness Maddock | 769 c1179 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, during the previous Parliament, we discussed this policy in some detail in other Bills....

Lord Cameron of Dillington | 769 c1179 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I had not really intended to intervene in this debate because better, more knowledgeabl...

Lord Stunell | 769 cc1179-1181 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support the amendment. I do so as somebody who in the other place proposed the Sustai...

Lord Campbell-Savours | 769 c1181 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I had not intended to speak in this debate at all until I heard what I can only describ...

Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 769 c1182 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, Amendment 54A, moved by the noble Baroness, Lady Parminter, has our full support. As no...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 cc1182-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, first, I applaud the noble Baroness, Lady Parminter, for braving the Chamber today with...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 cc1183-4 (Link to this contribution)

Perhaps I may make some progress. We all recognise the need to build more homes, and they should ...

Lord Beecham | 769 c1184 (Link to this contribution)

Can the noble Lord comment on that question? The noble Lord who spoke before indicated that the c...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1184 (Link to this contribution)

Yes, I was just coming to that point. The noble Lord, Lord Stunell, raised the issue of costs. Re...

Lord Stunell | 769 c1184 (Link to this contribution)

Will the Minister reaffirm that his brief tells him that the additional cost would be £3,000 per ...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1184 (Link to this contribution)

That is the figure I have mentioned and I am very happy to reaffirm that. However, in the same br...

Lord Krebs | 769 c1184 (Link to this contribution)

Can the Minister confirm that his brief contains a full cost-benefit analysis of these additional...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1184 (Link to this contribution)

This is definitely getting into a technical area, and I am happy to write to the noble Lord with ...

Lord Beecham | 769 c1184 (Link to this contribution)

May I ask a non-technical question—I am about as technical as the Minister—if £3,000 is an excess...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1185 (Link to this contribution)

I reiterate the figure that we have. I am very happy to write to the noble Lord, Lord Beecham, an...

Lord Beecham | 769 c1185 (Link to this contribution)

It is not about how the Government reached that figure but what, in their eyes, would be an accep...

Baroness Young of Old Scone | 769 c1185 (Link to this contribution)

I wonder whether the Minister might clear up a confusion that is arising in my mind. It strikes m...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1185 (Link to this contribution)

It does depend on where in the country we are talking about. Prices, as we know, can go up or dow...

Lord Foster of Bath | 769 c1185 (Link to this contribution)

I am very grateful to the Minister for that. He is absolutely right to point out that any governm...

Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 769 c1185 (Link to this contribution)

Before the Minister replies to that, perhaps I may follow up the point made by my noble friend La...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1186 (Link to this contribution)

I listened carefully to the evidence produced by the noble Lord, Lord Foster. Of course, I am ver...

Lord Stunell | 769 c1186 (Link to this contribution)

Before the Minister does so, could he tell us what evidence he has taken on the connection betwee...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1186 (Link to this contribution)

The evidence is pretty strong from the Federation of Master Builders, but in the same letter that...

Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 769 c1186 (Link to this contribution)

The Minister suggested to my noble friend Lady Hollis that people would not be able to pass on th...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1187 (Link to this contribution)

Yes, it is at build cost rather than purchasing cost.

Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 769 c1187 (Link to this contribution)

I assume that the builder would pass that on when they sold their houses and make sure that it wa...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1187 (Link to this contribution)

The point is that the onus of the £3,000 is on the housebuilding sector.

Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 769 c1187 (Link to this contribution)

Of course, the properties are bought at the end of the day; that is what they are built for. That...

Lord Porter of Spalding | 769 c1187 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, can I declare all of my interests, although we might be here forever? I am chairman of ...

Viscount Younger of Leckie | 769 c1187 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I had concluded my speech, but my noble friend made an interesting and useful intervent...

Baroness Parminter | 769 cc1187-8 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the Minister for his comments and I will be understandably brief, but I was very disappoi...

Lord Beecham | 769 c1188 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Beecham

55: Clause 62, page 28, line 8, at end insert “with the exclusi...

Lord Beecham | 769 cc1188-1193 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the Committee will now deploy its energies to the part of the Bill that deals with the ...

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 769 cc1193-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I shall speak to Amendments 56 and 57A. In doing so, I add my support to the other amen...

Lord Cameron of Dillington | 769 cc1194-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I will speak to Amendment 57B, tabled in my name, and also Amendment 57D, where I am an...

Bishop of St Albans | 769 cc1196-7 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support Amendment 56, tabled by the noble Baroness, Lady Royall, to which I have adde...

Baroness Bakewell of Hardington Mandeville | 769 cc1197-1200 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I draw the House’s attention to my interests as a vice-president of the LGA and a counc...

Baroness Redfern | 769 cc1200-1 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the amendments reflect an effort to address concerns about adequate housing provision, ...

Lord Best | 769 cc1202-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, we are now deep into the debate on the implementation of the voluntary right to buy for...

Lord Horam | 769 cc1205-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, it is very good to hear from the victor of 1983, if I may call the noble Lord that. It ...

Lord Beecham | 769 c1206 (Link to this contribution)

Perhaps the noble Lord would take it from me that it is not housing associations that I do not tr...

Lord Horam | 769 c1206 (Link to this contribution)

I am sorry but from the noble Lord’s remarks I felt that he showed a lack of trust in the motivat...

Lord Campbell-Savours | 769 c1206 (Link to this contribution)

Is the noble Lord then suggesting that a housing association would have the right to say, “You ca...

Lord Horam | 769 cc1206-7 (Link to this contribution)

Indeed, the right to buy is at the behest of the housing association. It can decide whether a hou...

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 769 c1207 (Link to this contribution)

I am sure that the situation has got a lot better but the figures I have are from 2013 and 2014, ...

Lord Horam | 769 c1207 (Link to this contribution)

With respect, financing is a different issue, which we are not discussing on these amendments.

Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 769 c1207 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I challenge the noble Lord on that. Clause 62 stand part is grouped with this, and that...

Lord Horam | 769 c1207 (Link to this contribution)

Yes, but that is a stand part debate; we are talking about amendments here. None the less, fundam...

Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 769 c1207 (Link to this contribution)

Given that the debate on whether Clause 62 should stand part is, by consent, grouped with this gr...

Lord Horam | 769 cc1207-8 (Link to this contribution)

I am sure that the noble Baroness will raise the issue if she wishes to. I will certainly not sto...

Lord Taylor of Goss Moor | 769 cc1208-1211 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I draw noble Lords’ attention to my list of interests but I declare a couple in particu...

Lord Kerslake | 769 cc1211-2 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I declare my interest as president of the Local Government Association and chair of Pea...

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 769 c1212 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, on a point of clarification, the noble Lord said that Peabody, rightly and understandab...

Lord Kerslake | 769 c1212 (Link to this contribution)

As has been said by a number of people, there are real issues about what we mean by a portable di...

Lord Young of Cookham | 769 c1213 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I shall make a brief contribution to what I suspect is the most controversial part of a...

Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 769 c1213 (Link to this contribution)

The noble Lord said that the Government would give the grant. Would it not be more accurate to sa...

Lord Young of Cookham | 769 cc1213-4 (Link to this contribution)

The Government give the grant, but—I think this is the point the noble Baroness is making—they ge...

Lord Beecham | 769 c1214 (Link to this contribution)

The noble Lord perhaps anticipates my intervention. If it is seen fit to include some categories,...

Lord Young of Cookham | 769 c1214 (Link to this contribution)

Because the housing associations have total discretion to include any category they wish, but the...

Lord Kerslake | 769 c1214 (Link to this contribution)

The point I was making was that the wider the choice of opportunities to buy you give tenants of ...

Lord Young of Cookham | 769 cc1214-5 (Link to this contribution)

Whichever route one goes down, whether the discount is available in the open market or restricted...

Lord Beecham | 769 c1215 (Link to this contribution)

It is the continuity of the Administration that bothers me.

Lord Young of Cookham | 769 c1215 (Link to this contribution)

I remember similar predictions being made back in 1979, when we introduced the right to buy for l...

Duke of Somerset | 769 cc1215-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support the general thrust of all this group of amendments, but in particular Amendme...

Lord Stoneham of Droxford | 769 cc1216-7 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I would quite like to take up the challenge to the noble Viscount, Lord Younger, as som...

Lord Berkeley | 769 cc1217-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have listened very carefully to all the arguments concerning the possible disposal of...

Lord Porter of Spalding | 769 cc1218-9 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, perhaps the Committee will indulge me for a few minutes. I benefited from the right to ...

Lord Tope | 769 cc1219-1220 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, we have been going for nearly two hours so I will resist the temptation to reply to the...

Lord McKenzie of Luton | 769 cc1220-1 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, perhaps I may add just marginally to the Minister’s burden in that regard. I want to pi...

Lord Best | 769 c1221 (Link to this contribution)

Perhaps the noble Lord will give way on that point. I think it is fair to say that the National H...

Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 769 c1221 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, if the noble Lord, Lord Best, will forgive me, I am not sure that that is correct. The ...

Baroness Grender | 769 cc1221-2 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I will be extremely brief. I am trying to raise, by way of my probing Amendment 60A, th...

Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 769 cc1222-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I will speak to this group, which includes the clause stand part debate. Last Thursday ...

Lord Taylor of Goss Moor | 769 c1223 (Link to this contribution)

I want to be absolutely clear on this point: the National Housing Federation has never supported ...

Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 769 c1224 (Link to this contribution)

The noble Lord has made precisely my point: the housing associations have looked after themselves...

Lord Shipley | 769 c1224 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I do not envy the Minister in having to reply to this debate, in one sense, but it has ...

Lord Beecham | 769 c1225 (Link to this contribution)

Does the noble Lord suggest that this should be like-for-like replacement?

Lord Shipley | 769 cc1225-6 (Link to this contribution)

The noble Lord takes the words out of my mouth, because my second safeguard is that there should ...

Baroness Williams of Trafford | 769 c1226 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, this has been an extensive debate and I hope that I can answer all the questions asked ...

Baroness Williams of Trafford | 769 c1226 (Link to this contribution)

If the noble Baroness does not mind, I will not give way. I would like to make progress and perha...

Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 769 c1226 (Link to this contribution)

This is a large group and we shall have trouble tracking all the questions that noble Lords want ...

Baroness Williams of Trafford | 769 cc1227-9 (Link to this contribution)

That is why I want to make progress. If the noble Baroness will pick me up on her question at the...

Lord Taylor of Goss Moor | 769 c1229 (Link to this contribution)

Will the Minister reflect further with her colleagues on the contradiction in what she has just s...

Baroness Williams of Trafford | 769 cc1230-1 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, maybe I did not articulate it properly. The engagement between housing associations and...

Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 769 c1231 (Link to this contribution)

It would perhaps have been more appropriate if the Minister could have taken the query at the tim...

Baroness Williams of Trafford | 769 c1232 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I did not cover high-value assets and the noble Baroness’s point because it has been an...

Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 769 c1232 (Link to this contribution)

But they were raised tonight. I think we have a right to hear what the Minister says so that when...

Baroness Williams of Trafford | 769 c1232 (Link to this contribution)

I repeat that we will have full opportunity to discuss those points in future groups of amendment...

Lord Beecham | 769 cc1232-4 (Link to this contribution)

In that same spirit, perhaps the Minister will confirm that we will have the information on start...

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