It is interesting how, when we listen to a debate, our own speech changes according to what we have just heard. To give credit where it is due, the description provided by the hon. Member for Liverpool, Walton (Dan Carden) of what it was like to be homosexual and serving in the armed services rang a very strong bell with me.
My father had a much-loved cousin—he is dead now —who rose to a fairly high rank in the armed forces. Of course, all his life he was a homosexual. I remember him describing to me, not long before he died, what it was like to live a lie, because he did not dare come out or admit to his sexuality. He eventually came out in his 80s and had a partner before he died, and it was great. That always sticks with me, so I compliment the hon. Gentleman.
What the shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Portsmouth South (Stephen Morgan), and the hon. Member for Glasgow North West (Carol Monaghan) said about indefinite leave to remain, which has been mentioned many times in this debate, is very important. New clause 1 stands in my name, and I want to take it as far as possible. I hope the day will come when interpreters or anyone who has served Queen and country, and frankly risked their life, will be afforded the most assistance to become a permanent part of our country.
I have mentioned this several times in the past, and I want to make a point that I do not think other Members have touched on. In doing this sort of thing, word gets back to the countries these people originally come from, and that generates good will. Recruitment is the theme of my speech, and that good will helps us address a problem that I have heard about over and again in my four years in this place: that we are not recruiting the numbers that we need. We should never underestimate the importance of good will when it comes to recruitment.
I would be obliged if the Minister would pass on my thanks to his colleague, the Minister for the Armed Forces, the hon. Member for Wells (James Heappey), who kindly hosted a most interesting briefing about Mali. The shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Portsmouth South (Stephen Morgan), was there as well. When we heard what was being done by our services personnel in Mali to ensure peace and to do good in the world, it really did sound very good indeed and was very encouraging.
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I absolutely get the need for us in this place to be clever in our defence of the country. I understand why we must do what we must do on cyber. I understand the importance of getting into space, an aspect that we are going to have to watch. I understand the importance of hyper-sonic speed and the use of drones in both defence and attack, if we have to use them. Technology and gadgets are absolutely part of what we will have to do in future, yet when I think about the recruitment problem and those soldiers who have been out in Mali—they are about to be relieved by another battalion—I conclude that no matter how clever the gadgets or the science, at the end of the day, if we are going to do jobs such as peacekeeping in Mali or interventions wherever we must in the world, we need boots on the ground. That is why, as I have said before in this place, I am concerned about what appears to be a 10,000 personnel cut in the British Army. I do not believe that that is sustainable, and I say that on the record.
It may be hard for right hon. and hon. Members to believe, but before I ever came near this place I had a career in oil, with a drilling or production company. Not so long ago, I had a briefing with some of the oil firms that are working in the North sea, and they worried me a lot by telling me about the problems they were having with recruiting suitable young people into the industry. Why? It is because, quite unfairly, oil is seen to be a sunset industry, so some of the brightest and best say, “I don’t fancy a job with BP. I don’t think so. I’m going to do something else. I would like to work in the City of London and make squillions.”
My final point is that if we take the British Army below a certain critical mass of numbers, young people who might otherwise make a huge contribution to the defence of this country in our armed services could look at that career option and say, “I don’t see a great future there. It’s shrinking all the time. I think I’ll do something else.” That is a dangerous place to be if we value the defence of this country. It is about boots on the ground—it was hundreds of years ago and it still is today—if we want to defend our realm, which we love so well.