UK Parliament / Open data

Deep Sea Mining Bill

Debate on bills on Friday, 6 September 2013, in the House of Commons, led by Sheryll Murray. The answering member was Alistair Burt.
Motion that the House sit in private. Speaker declared that the Question was not decided because fewer than 40 Members had participated in the Division (0 to 33). (Standing Order No. 41). Second reading. Agreed to on question. Bill committed to a Public Bill Committee.

About these Parliamentary proceedings

Reference

567 cc589-639 

Session

2013-14

Legislative stage

Second reading

Chamber / Committee

House of Commons chamber
Deep Sea Mining Bill 2013-14
Wednesday, 19 June 2013
Bills
House of Commons
Deposited Paper DEP2013-1561
Friday, 6 September 2013
Deposited papers
House of Commons

Proceeding contributions

Sheryll Murray | 567 c590 (Link to this contribution)

I beg to move, That the Bill be now read a Second time.

Mining is not a new industry, certa...

Peter Bottomley | 567 c590 (Link to this contribution)

I cannot remember whether I picked this up in 1981 when the Deep Sea Mining (Temporary Provisions...


Show all contributions (143)
Sheryll Murray | 567 c590 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is absolutely correct. I am sure that they still pride themselves in taking their ...

Alistair Burt | 567 c590 (Link to this contribution)

I hope they withstand high pressure.

Sheryll Murray | 567 c590 (Link to this contribution)

Absolutely.

It gives me great pride as a Cornishwoman to take this Bill forward in Parliame...

Charlie Elphicke | 567 c590 (Link to this contribution)

I congratulate my hon. Friend on bringing the Bill to the House. Is the Bill necessary because te...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c590 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is partially correct. The Bill is all about exploitation. We have the potential in...

Peter Bottomley | 567 c591 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend probably already appreciates that we must change our provisions because the 1981 A...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c591 (Link to this contribution)

We are seeing a shortage of some metals, and the deep sea provides the opportunity to gather meta...

David Nuttall | 567 c591 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend makes a persuasive case for her Bill, but as she admits that an application has al...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c591 (Link to this contribution)

The 1981 Act predates our signing up to the United Nations convention on the law of the sea, so i...

Peter Bottomley | 567 c591 (Link to this contribution)

Just to clear my mind by using my mouth rather than just my ears, I think this is a very conserva...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c591 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is correct.

The UK was able to sponsor and issue a licence to that company u...

Philip Davies | 567 c591 (Link to this contribution)

This is complicated stuff, most of which is way over my head, but it seems rather bureaucratic. W...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c591 (Link to this contribution)

Under the United Nations convention on the law of the sea, any resources beyond the 200-mile limi...

Philip Davies | 567 c592 (Link to this contribution)

Does that mean that a company cannot apply to the ISA for a licence without the sponsorship of a ...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c592 (Link to this contribution)

That is correct. I am sure that my hon. Friend the Minister will be able to expand on that if he ...

Peter Bottomley | 567 c592 (Link to this contribution)

In time, my hon. Friend will get to paragraph 9 of the schedule, which states:

“Omit sectio...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c592 (Link to this contribution)

That is right, and of course this Government want to minimise bureaucracy as much as possible.

David Nuttall | 567 c592 (Link to this contribution)

As my hon. Friend will be aware, the United States of America has not signed or ratified the agre...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c592 (Link to this contribution)

I know that Secretary of State Clinton and the United States Administration were, as recently as ...

Peter Bottomley | 567 c592 (Link to this contribution)

Speaking as an historian, I point out that in 1994 the United States got a modification to the co...

Sheryll Murray | 567 cc592-3 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for his expertise and for updating us.

As I have said, the ...

Charlie Elphicke | 567 c593 (Link to this contribution)

I thank my hon. Friend for giving way again; she is being very generous in taking interventions. ...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c593 (Link to this contribution)

I hope my hon. Friend will be patient, because I will come on to that later.

UNCLOS defines...

Charlie Elphicke | 567 c593 (Link to this contribution)

A mining process could lead to contamination of the sea, which might either contaminate the fish ...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c593 (Link to this contribution)

Deep-sea mining takes place at great depth in specific areas of the ocean. I do not think that th...

Barry Gardiner | 567 c593 (Link to this contribution)

I am most heartened by the hon. Lady’s response to the hon. Member for Dover (Charlie Elphicke) t...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c594 (Link to this contribution)

I welcome the hon. Gentleman’s intervention. I think the whole House will know how interested he ...

David Nuttall | 567 c594 (Link to this contribution)

If I may assist my hon. Friend, I think that section 5 of the 1981 Act is pertinent to the point ...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c594 (Link to this contribution)

That is very helpful. I am sure my hon. Friend can reassure the hon. Member for Brent North (Barr...

Philip Davies | 567 c594 (Link to this contribution)

I must confess that, not for the first time this morning, I am slightly confused by what my hon. ...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c594 (Link to this contribution)

No, it will not, because we already have the ISA granting contracts—I will come on to who holds c...

Charlie Elphicke | 567 c595 (Link to this contribution)

Rare earth metals are used in mobile telephones. I believe that there may be some such metals in ...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c595 (Link to this contribution)

Absolutely. That is another point that I will address.

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 567 c595 (Link to this contribution)

Following up on the intervention by my hon. Friend the Member for Shipley (Philip Davies), is a c...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c595 (Link to this contribution)

Companies in countries that are not signatories to UNCLOS would have to find a host that was a si...

David Nuttall | 567 c595 (Link to this contribution)

I am interested to hear that there have been developments in this field this year. Will my hon. F...

Sheryll Murray | 567 cc595-6 (Link to this contribution)

I have received one e-mail requesting a meeting from WWF, which is very friendly towards the Bill...

David Nuttall | 567 c596 (Link to this contribution)

Although my hon. Friend says that it does not involve any excavation, as I read the Bill, it does...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c596 (Link to this contribution)

I will come on to that, but I can inform my hon. Friend that I was referring specifically to poly...

Charlie Elphicke | 567 c596 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend drew a distinction between deep-sea mining and fracking. Will she confirm that fra...

Sheryll Murray | 567 cc596-7 (Link to this contribution)

We are talking about sourcing hydrocarbons, which I will move on to a little later in my speech. ...

Philip Davies | 567 c597 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend suggests that the industry is still in its infancy, and I appreciate that, but the...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c597 (Link to this contribution)

I was not around in the House during the passing of the 1981 Act.

Sheryll Murray | 567 cc597-8 (Link to this contribution)

I have to confess that I was—a long time before, in fact.

All I can say to my hon. Friend t...

Barry Gardiner | 567 c598 (Link to this contribution)

I am delighted to speak in this debate, which is important not simply because of the economic int...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c598 (Link to this contribution)

Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the polymetallic nodules are golf ball-size spheres that occur i...

Barry Gardiner | 567 cc598-9 (Link to this contribution)

Let me give the hon. Lady the assurance that I am sure the Bill will pass on Second Reading. I ha...

Alistair Burt | 567 c599 (Link to this contribution)

Does the hon. Gentleman intend to present evidence on any matters that would affect the issue of ...

Barry Gardiner | 567 c599 (Link to this contribution)

As the Minister knows, few licences have been granted since the 1981 Act took effect, so I would ...

Philip Davies | 567 c599 (Link to this contribution)

There are always uncertainties, so the precautionary principle would mean that we never did anyth...

Barry Gardiner | 567 cc599-600 (Link to this contribution)

That is a very interesting interpretation of the precautionary principle—that because misgivings ...

David Nuttall | 567 c600 (Link to this contribution)

It is a great pleasure, as always, to follow the hon. Member for Brent North (Barry Gardiner), wh...

Philip Davies | 567 c600 (Link to this contribution)

Has my hon. Friend identified the contradiction in what the hon. Member for Brent North (Barry Ga...

David Nuttall | 567 c600 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is right. There is a contradiction in that position. It is interesting to ask at w...

Philip Davies | 567 c600 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend endorse the words of our former colleague, Teddy Taylor, who said in the deba...

David Nuttall | 567 cc600-1 (Link to this contribution)

I read those comments, although I am sure that with the Under-Secretary of State for Foreign and ...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c601 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend agree that this country has always been a world leader in oceanographic studi...

David Nuttall | 567 c601 (Link to this contribution)

It is true that this nation has been a world leader in exploring the world. As an island nation w...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c601 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend agree that that could have been because discussions were taking place about t...

David Nuttall | 567 c601 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. Indeed, I was coming on to say that my understanding was prec...

Barry Gardiner | 567 c602 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman just used the important word: “hard” mineral resources. The Bill would excise ...

David Nuttall | 567 cc602-4 (Link to this contribution)

I cannot give any assurances about that; it is not for me to do that. I know that the hon. Gentle...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c603 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend agree that we had to pass an Act of Parliament even though we were a member o...

David Nuttall | 567 cc603-7 (Link to this contribution)

I am extremely grateful to my hon. Friend for bringing up the matter of the European Union. I was...

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 567 c607 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend share my view that it is a pity so to tidy up the statute book as to remove t...

David Nuttall | 567 cc607-8 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is absolutely right, and this is a case in point. The House was given all sorts of...

Philip Davies | 567 cc608-9 (Link to this contribution)

It is a pleasure to follow my hon. Friend the Member for Bury North (Mr Nuttall), who, as usual, ...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c609 (Link to this contribution)

Some of the cone-shaped polymetallic nodules are alive and smoking, and certain marine creatures ...

Philip Davies | 567 c609 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend has far more expertise in this field than me, and I am grateful to her for that cl...

David Nuttall | 567 c610 (Link to this contribution)

In a similar vein, does my hon. Friend not think there will be some difficulty in establishing wh...

Philip Davies | 567 c610 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend makes a good point, and I hope that such detailed questions, which go way beyond m...

Russell Brown | 567 c610 (Link to this contribution)

I agree to a certain extent with what the hon. Gentleman says, but what if the damage is so signi...

Philip Davies | 567 cc610-1 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for giving me more credit than I am due. I was not claiming a...

David Nuttall | 567 c611 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend think there is any merit in the international community, through the auspices...

Philip Davies | 567 c611 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend makes a very good point, and it should be considered. Again, the Minister may be a...

John Bercow | 567 c611 (Link to this contribution)

Order. The hon. Gentleman is making a conscientious application to serve on the Bill Committee, w...

Philip Davies | 567 c611 (Link to this contribution)

I am very grateful to you for highlighting my pitch for me, in a far more eloquent way than I was...

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 567 c611 (Link to this contribution)

I am concerned that my hon. Friend might have been tempted down a dangerously internationalist pa...

Philip Davies | 567 cc611-2 (Link to this contribution)

I certainly agree with that. I am not sure that what my two hon. Friends are saying is necessaril...

David Nuttall | 567 c612 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend share my concern that perhaps one reason why so few licences have been applie...

Philip Davies | 567 cc612-3 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend makes a good point, and we certainly would not want what he describes to have been...

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 567 cc613-5 (Link to this contribution)

It is a great pleasure to follow my hon. Friends the Members for Shipley (Philip Davies) and for ...

Philip Davies | 567 c615 (Link to this contribution)

Is my hon. Friend saying that, given the lack of support for internationalism, so to speak, we sh...

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 567 cc615-6 (Link to this contribution)

That is an exciting way of looking at it—to adopt a real free-market approach, which allows compa...

John Bercow | 567 c616 (Link to this contribution)

Order. I am all agog at the racy and intoxicating oration that the hon. Gentleman is delivering t...

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 567 cc616-7 (Link to this contribution)

Because so many other Members are keen to speak in the debate, I shall keep my remarks short. I k...

Philip Davies | 567 c617 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend knows that I agree with him about this, and in my time I have unsuccessfully tried...

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 567 c617 (Link to this contribution)

If only that were true. I would hope that Bills would be repealed at any time, but sadly the Hous...

Lindsay Hoyle | 567 c617 (Link to this contribution)

This will be an even longer stint.

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 567 cc617-8 (Link to this contribution)

Then Mr Deputy Speaker will no doubt be pleased that I will try to entertain him for at least par...

Russell Brown | 567 c618 (Link to this contribution)

It is a privilege to follow the hon. Member for North East Somerset (Jacob Rees-Mogg). With you h...

Russell Brown | 567 cc618-9 (Link to this contribution)

I suspect that he would have been.

I congratulate the hon. Member for South East Cornwall (...

David Nuttall | 567 c619 (Link to this contribution)

On the question of policing, does the hon. Gentleman think that the present provision in section ...

Russell Brown | 567 c619 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the hon. Gentleman for that intervention. It raises the question of how the inspectors ca...

Barry Gardiner | 567 c619 (Link to this contribution)

I am sure that my hon. Friend will understand that the provision of inspectors relates more to th...

Russell Brown | 567 c619 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is absolutely right to provide that distinction. Again, without wishing to put pre...

David Nuttall | 567 c620 (Link to this contribution)

I am listening carefully to the hon. Gentleman. Does he think the primary responsibility for the ...

Russell Brown | 567 c620 (Link to this contribution)

At the end of the day, we are passing legislation that must meet the needs of mining companies an...

Alistair Burt | 567 c620 (Link to this contribution)

It is a great pleasure to be able to respond to the debate. I begin, of course, by congratulating...

Alistair Burt | 567 c621 (Link to this contribution)

As I think the House knows well, Bury North is not only a constituency that I was proud to repres...

Lindsay Hoyle | 567 c621 (Link to this contribution)

Order. Before the Minister gives way, it may help if I say that we are not going to have a love-i...

David Nuttall | 567 c621 (Link to this contribution)

I will take the Minister’s good wishes back to Bury, but to return to the Bill, does he agree tha...

Alistair Burt | 567 c621 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. I remember—he will know this from first-hand knowledge—how wi...

Lindsay Hoyle | 567 c621 (Link to this contribution)

Order. I am now intervening. It is a great temptation to listen to the Minister talk about the wo...

Alistair Burt | 567 c621 (Link to this contribution)

With that admonition, Mr Deputy Speaker, I will leave the subject of Bury North when I have remin...

Lindsay Hoyle | 567 c621 (Link to this contribution)

Order. I will help the Minister. I do not want to hear about football or about Bury, and certainl...

Alistair Burt | 567 cc621-4 (Link to this contribution)

I should like to set out responses to the Bill, which was introduced by my hon. Friend the Member...

Alistair Burt | 567 c624 (Link to this contribution)

I will answer colleagues’ questions in due course, but I am happy to take an intervention now.

Barry Gardiner | 567 c624 (Link to this contribution)

I might have missed it in the Minister’s remarks about the various chemicals, but the briefings t...

Alistair Burt | 567 cc624-5 (Link to this contribution)

The point I was making in going through the three mineral types is that they are the ones that ar...

Barry Gardiner | 567 c625 (Link to this contribution)

The Minister has drawn a parallel that will have ramifications for the environmental agenda. He w...

Alistair Burt | 567 cc625-6 (Link to this contribution)

That is the intention not only of the hon. Gentleman and his party; it is part of the Bill’s rais...

Barry Gardiner | 567 c626 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful to the Minister for trying to respond fully to my concerns. I appreciate that. Howe...

Alistair Burt | 567 c626 (Link to this contribution)

I am sure that my hon. Friend the Member for South East Cornwall will give that matter her consid...

David Nuttall | 567 c626 (Link to this contribution)

Does the Minister have any evidence to suggest that any companies have been put off from applying...

Alistair Burt | 567 cc626-8 (Link to this contribution)

No. The sort of work we are talking about is immensely expensive. If a company is to get down and...

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 567 c628 (Link to this contribution)

Is that also the view of the United States Government, or might they be willing to protect an Ame...

Alistair Burt | 567 cc628-9 (Link to this contribution)

Obviously I cannot speak for the United States Government. I am not sure whether they would be ab...

David Nuttall | 567 c629 (Link to this contribution)

I mentioned in an intervention that I had been interested to hear that an application had been gr...

Alistair Burt | 567 cc629-631 (Link to this contribution)

I doubt it very much. Speaking off the top of my head, I imagine there would be a passing-on prov...

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 567 c631 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful to the Minister for giving way. Under the treaty of Windsor of 1386, our oldest all...

Alistair Burt | 567 cc631-2 (Link to this contribution)

This is a fact never lost on the Foreign and Commonwealth Office. I also have in my room at the F...

Alistair Burt | 567 c632 (Link to this contribution)

Of course, and I will check on the tickets before we go.

Barry Gardiner | 567 c633 (Link to this contribution)

Just to correct the impression that may have been given to the House by the hon. Member for North...

Lindsay Hoyle | 567 c633 (Link to this contribution)

Order. I think the hon. Gentleman is testing the patience of the Chamber a little bit, and I will...

Alistair Burt | 567 c633 (Link to this contribution)

Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker.

The procedures for handling applications to explore for miner...

Russell Brown | 567 c633 (Link to this contribution)

For clarity, would the Minister be prepared to put copies of those documents in the Library for o...

Alistair Burt | 567 cc633-7 (Link to this contribution)

I do not know yet, because these are applications relating to commercial companies. I will check....

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 567 c636 (Link to this contribution)

On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker. The Minister referred to placing papers that contain conf...

Lindsay Hoyle | 567 c638 (Link to this contribution)

That is obviously a matter for the Minister, but as the hon. Gentleman is going off a previous ru...

Sheryll Murray | 567 c638 (Link to this contribution)

The explanatory notes that accompany my Bill state that a copy of the impact assessment will be a...

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