UK Parliament / Open data

Pensions and Social Security

Debates on delegated legislation on Thursday, 23 February 2012, in the House of Commons, led by Steve Webb. The answering member was Stephen Timms.
Draft Pensions Act 2008 (Abolition of Protected Rights) (Consequential Amendments) (No. 2) (Amendment) Order 2012, draft Guaranteed Minimum Pensions Increase Order 2012 and draft Social Security Benefits Up-rating Order 2012. Debate on motions to approve. Agreed to on question.

About these Parliamentary proceedings

Reference

540 c1040-72 

Session

2010-12

Department

Department for Work and Pensions

Chamber / Committee

House of Commons chamber

Related items

Social Security Benefits Up-rating Order 2012
Monday, 30 January 2012
Statutory instruments
House of Lords
House of Commons
Pensions Act 2008 (Abolition of Protected Rights) (Consequential Amendments) (No. 2) (Amendment) Order 2012
Monday, 30 January 2012
Statutory instruments
House of Lords
House of Commons
Guaranteed Minimum Pensions Increase Order 2012
Monday, 30 January 2012
Statutory instruments
House of Lords
House of Commons

Proceeding contributions

Stephen Timms | 540 c1047-8 (Link to this contribution) The Minister has helpfully explained that we are dealing with three separate orders, aspects of whic...
George Hollingbery | 540 c1048 (Link to this contribution) I seem to recall some embarrassment in the Labour party back in 2000 when the low rate of 1.1% was u...

Show all contributions (89)
Stephen Timms | 540 c1048 (Link to this contribution) That is a matter that the Minister may well want to comment on in his response to this debate. In my...
Oliver Heald | 540 c1048 (Link to this contribution) Does the right hon. Gentleman agree that we need to exercise judgment about what the increase should...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1048 (Link to this contribution) Of course, that is indeed the effect of the mechanism that the Government have chosen. I would simpl...
Ian Jnr Paisley | 540 c1048 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman has mentioned the triple lock, which interests me and which applies only to...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1049 (Link to this contribution) As the Minister well knows, the basic state pension was uprated over a long period in line with RPI....
Stephen Timms | 540 c1048-9 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman's argument is a different one from the Minister's. The Minister says that because...
Steve Webb | 540 c1049 (Link to this contribution) Will the right hon. Gentleman confirm that the statutory position that his Government left—and which...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1044 (Link to this contribution) This takes us back to the point raised by the hon. Member for Bury St Edmunds (Mr Ruffley). The Mini...
Steve Webb | 540 c1044 (Link to this contribution) On the contrary, let us bear in mind what the Government have done: the Chancellor has taken action ...
Stephen Lloyd | 540 c1044-5 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that the Government came under considerable pressure not to opt for 5.2% b...
Steve Webb | 540 c1044 (Link to this contribution) It is the highest cash increase ever and the highest real-terms increase for about 10 years.
Stephen Timms | 540 c1044 (Link to this contribution) Given that the increase is purely in line with inflation, how can the Minister describe it as a real...
Steve Webb | 540 c1045 (Link to this contribution) Indeed. My hon. Friend is right that there were siren voices from some quarters suggesting that we c...
Oliver Heald | 540 c1045 (Link to this contribution) Does the Minister agree that the Government have also gone further than they needed to on the pensio...
Steve Webb | 540 c1045 (Link to this contribution) There was indeed. My carefully structured speech is falling to ribbons. I was about to come to that ...
Ian Jnr Paisley | 540 c1045 (Link to this contribution) Although I understand the point about the real increase in the state pension from £102.15 to £107.45...
Glyn Davies | 540 c1043 (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I should declare an interest, having reached an age at which I benefit personally from this ...
Steve Webb | 540 c1043 (Link to this contribution) The volume of my ministerial correspondence on this issue has been very light. Almost all of it was ...
Oliver Heald | 540 c1042 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the Minister for being so generous with his time. Does he agree that some quite sig...
Steve Webb | 540 c1042-3 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is right. I noticed in the most recent figures that the gap between CPI and RPI was j...
Steve Webb | 540 c1042 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady is right that any single inflation measure will not capture the full diversity of circ...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1044 (Link to this contribution) I thought that was what the Minister said. Perhaps he can clarify that point, because by definition ...
Steve Webb | 540 c1043-4 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady may not have been in the Chamber when I referred to next week's debate, when we will d...
David Ruffley | 540 c1041 (Link to this contribution) Has the Minister had any representations regarding the apparent iniquity of uprating by CPI on the b...
Steve Webb | 540 c1041 (Link to this contribution) I am most grateful, although my initial oratory has already drawn one hon. Member into the House. If...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1041 (Link to this contribution) As the Minister knows, the UK Statistics Authority has said that CPI should be used for that purpose...
Steve Webb | 540 c1041 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is right that when the uprating was considered, there was speculation that a differen...
Eilidh Whiteford | 540 c1042 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the Minister for addressing one issue that I wanted to raise with him, but I am als...
Steve Webb | 540 c1042 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman rightly says that the consumer prices advisory committee is looking at how ...
Speaker | 540 c1040 (Link to this contribution) With this we shall take the following motions, on pensions and on social security:"That the draft Gu...
Steve Webb | 540 c1040 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move,"That the draft Pensions Act 2008 (Abolition of Protected Rights) (Consequential Amend...
Oliver Heald | 540 c1040 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend not think that it is really rather a tribute to his work that the orders are so ...
Steve Webb | 540 c1040 (Link to this contribution) The draft Guaranteed Minimum Pensions Increase Order 2012 provides for contracted-out defined-benefi...
Speaker | 540 c1040 (Link to this contribution) I understand that for the convenience of the House, motions 1 to 3 are to be taken together.
Stephen Timms | 540 c1051 (Link to this contribution) I thank the hon. Lady for her generous remark. There is some merit in having an earnings underpin to...
Sarah Newton | 540 c1051 (Link to this contribution) But does the right hon. Gentleman not see the benefit for pensioners and the wider economy of the ce...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1050 (Link to this contribution) The point I am making is that if the RPI method were in place for the coming year, the increase woul...
Sarah Newton | 540 c1050-1 (Link to this contribution) I acknowledge the right hon. Gentleman's deep knowledge of this subject, but he is not giving the Ho...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1051 (Link to this contribution) It is not clear what the degree of certainty is. As I have said, the triple lock was overridden last...
Steve Webb | 540 c1049 (Link to this contribution) But if the right hon. Gentleman thought that in the event of prices being higher than earnings he wo...
Stephen Lloyd | 540 c1050 (Link to this contribution) Does the right hon. Gentleman agree, however, that if the Labour Government had used the triple lock...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1050 (Link to this contribution) I shall deal with the last point immediately. I have said that if this Government had proposed a tem...
George Hollingbery | 540 c1050 (Link to this contribution) I think I understood the right hon. Gentleman to say that he has made a commitment that, had a Labou...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1049-50 (Link to this contribution) It is probably the case that the Government's poor performance on inflation—to go back to a point th...
Sarah Newton | 540 c1060 (Link to this contribution) I completely disagree with the suggestion that we are targeting the most vulnerable people, but my q...
Baroness Clark of Kilwinning | 540 c1060 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady may shake her head, and she has spoken about many aspects of Government policy, but sh...
Sarah Newton | 540 c1058 (Link to this contribution) The shadow Minister, the right hon. Member for East Ham, referred to the wider context of these meas...
Sarah Newton | 540 c1057-8 (Link to this contribution) I entirely take those points on board, Madam Deputy Speaker. I hope that the House will forgive my e...
Speaker | 540 c1058 (Link to this contribution) Order. We are talking about pensions and benefits uprating. We are not having a wider debate on all ...
Eilidh Whiteford | 540 c1056 (Link to this contribution) Obviously I cannot speak for the Northern Ireland Member who raised the issue pertaining to his cons...
Speaker | 540 c1056-7 (Link to this contribution) Order. I remind the hon. Lady that she is making an intervention, not a speech—yet. Before the hon....
Sarah Newton | 540 c1055-6 (Link to this contribution) It is a great pleasure to be able to speak in the debate, and it saddens me that I to have to begin ...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1052-4 (Link to this contribution) I am simply making the point that if the Government had proposed a temporary switch to CPI uprating,...
Eilidh Whiteford | 540 c1052 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman has advocated a temporary use of CPI, but will he clarify whether he is adv...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1054-5 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for not accusing me of being naughty—indeed, rather the reverse....
Stephen Lloyd | 540 c1054 (Link to this contribution) I have enjoyed listening to the right hon. Gentleman. In my time in Parliament, I have always apprec...
Oliver Heald | 540 c1051 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman is being a bit naughty. It is a general provision in many pension schemes t...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1051 (Link to this contribution) I deny being naughty. I am simply making the point that the Government have been telling pensioners ...
Ian Jnr Paisley | 540 c1051 (Link to this contribution) Far be it from me to encourage the right hon. Gentleman to be naughty, but is there not a certainty ...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1052 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. People will feel that loss to a significant extent. Those b...
Andrew Bingham | 540 c1051 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman talks about certainty, but will he acknowledge that the triple lock will gi...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1051 (Link to this contribution) As I have said, in the first year that the triple lock was due to be put in place, it was overridden...
Steve Webb | 540 c1070-1 (Link to this contribution) Indeed. If one could obtain pretty robust and independently accepted forecasts—although that prompts...
Steve Webb | 540 c1068-9 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to all hon. Members who have taken part in this debate. The hon. Member for Banff and ...
David Ruffley | 540 c1069 (Link to this contribution) The burden of my argument did not relate especially to last autumn's figure but to the principle of ...
Steve Webb | 540 c1071 (Link to this contribution) I will in a second. Clearly, those numbers all fluctuate relative to each other. Perhaps the right h...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1071 (Link to this contribution) I want to focus on the year ahead. Will the Minister confirm that the triple lock will deliver a low...
Gregg McClymont | 540 c1066-8 (Link to this contribution) I thank the hon. Gentleman for that clarification. As a public spending hawk, as he described himsel...
David Ruffley | 540 c1066 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman is reciting the argument brilliantly, but those are not my figures; they are my f...
Gregg McClymont | 540 c1065-6 (Link to this contribution) I shall not detain the House for long, I hope. We have had an interesting debate, which was begun by...
Speaker | 540 c1060 (Link to this contribution) Order. I would love to answer that question, but I am prevented from doing so. The hon. Lady knows t...
Baroness Clark of Kilwinning | 540 c1060 (Link to this contribution) I am very grateful for that, Madam Deputy Speaker. The impact of the changes to benefits and pensio...
Nick de Bois | 540 c1060 (Link to this contribution) Has the hon. Lady considered putting this in context? People on low incomes are nevertheless receivi...
Baroness Clark of Kilwinning | 540 c1060-1 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for the hon. Gentleman's contribution, and I agree fully with what he is saying; we do...
David Ruffley | 540 c1061-3 (Link to this contribution) I wish to say something about the public spending implications of using the September 2011 CPI figur...
Stephen Lloyd | 540 c1063 (Link to this contribution) It is a pleasure to speak in this debate because, unlike my hon. Friend the Member for Bury St Edmun...
David Ruffley | 540 c1063-4 (Link to this contribution) Let me be clear: although we all welcome the generous uprating for pensioners, does my hon. Friend, ...
Stephen Lloyd | 540 c1064-5 (Link to this contribution) I thank my hon. Friend for that question, but I disagree as I think that it is even more important t...
Steve Webb | 540 c1045-7 (Link to this contribution) Let me address that issue directly. Any pensioner will say that the basic state pension is the most ...
Steve Webb | 540 c1044 (Link to this contribution) Because the point at which the money is paid is not the point at which inflation is measured, so whe...
Baroness Clark of Kilwinning | 540 c1043 (Link to this contribution) I apologise for missing the beginning of the Minister's opening remarks. Will not the change mean a ...
Baroness Clark of Kilwinning | 540 c1058-60 (Link to this contribution) I apologise for not being in the Chamber at the start of the Minister's speech. I always find his co...
Steve Webb | 540 c1071-2 (Link to this contribution) It is interesting that the Labour party has said that it does not support the orders, which include ...
Stephen Timms | 540 c1044 (Link to this contribution) A minute or two ago, the Minister said that this was the highest ever real-terms increase to the sta...

Subjects

Benefits rules
Index linking
Workplace pensions
Pensions
Social security benefits
State retirement pensions
Reform
Uprating

Legislation

Social Security Benefits Up-rating Order 2012
Guaranteed Minimum Pensions Increase Order 2012
Pensions Act 2008 (Abolition of Protected Rights) (Consequential Amendments) (No. 2) (Amendment) Order 2012

Link

View this Parliamentary proceeding on www.publications.parliament.uk
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