European Union Bill

My Lords, I may not be alone in your Lordships’ House in feeling a little weary that, after all this time, two things which could be kept separate have been inextricably mingled together: the question of holding a referendum and the question of the British position in and policy towards Europe. This has been dragging on in one form or another for a long time now. It is almost 17 years to the day since I had a message from the then Prime Minister, John Major: would I undertake a delicate mission for him, which was to sound out his Cabinet one by one on the proposition of committing the party to holding a referendum, should we decide to enter the euro. I knocked on various doors: I knocked on the doors of enthusiasts; I knocked on the doors of sceptics. I had to report to the Prime Minister that there was no support for the proposal. He and I were the only people who supported it, and I was getting a bit wobbly. Two years later, in 1996, he managed to rally a sufficiency of the party and colleagues to put that in our manifesto. That started the whole process. Tony Blair followed suit, and so it went on. That whole connection between the two things took shape and has been with us ever since. There is something to be said for trying to separate them, but we cannot. I am as realistic a politician as anyone here. I understand the political urge; I understand the coalition document; I understand why my noble friend Lord Howell utters the words ““coalition document”” almost with the tone of one approaching an altar. I understand the realities of the situation, and they require a measure of this kind, but if we could find some way of mitigating it—to use a phrase which has already been used—then we should try to do that. Some way of reasserting at any rate the concept of a parliamentary democracy, in which it is Parliament that takes decisions on ratifying treaties, would be a step in the right direction. I am approaching the noble Lord’s amendment from a slightly different angle, but this is the angle from which I see it. As I read the Bill, there are certain ways in which a referendum can be made unnecessary. One way is the significance clause, which has already been referred to and which we will be debating. It will be a method of avoiding a referendum on insignificant matters. That procedure is laid down: the Minister makes a statement, which can be challenged in judicial review, but it is a government initiative and Parliament takes the decision. The other way is implicit in this amendment: it is to let the people do it. If there is a proposition in which the people are totally uninterested, or uninterested to a very substantial extent and they record that lack of interest by not turning up—by staying at home—then there is an overwhelming argument in terms of democratic theory and, as the noble Lord said, in terms of the recent practice of this House of saying that, in that case, the referendum is advisory and not binding. Then the matter will not go through but be returned to the place which ought to be the fountain and authority of this decision: it will go back to Parliament. That is the provision of this amendment, and it is a sound one. It is an imperfect, incomplete way of making it clear that we have not abandoned the basic thought that we are in a parliamentary democracy and that Parliament should take decisions of this kind. We accept that, in certain cases which are specified and numerous, the people should be consulted directly. We have got that far and there is no rowing back from that. However, by passing this amendment we should emphasise that that is not all that could be said on the matter and that there is a case for taking a modest step towards a return to parliamentary democracy in this field. My noble friend on the Front Bench is never stubborn and I hope that he will feel able to smile on this amendment—or, if he grumbles, that he will grumble in a very mild voice about it. It is a move in a direction which many of us favour, although we cannot carry it as far as we might wish tonight.