Pensions Bill

My Lords, we are pretty much where we were when we discussed the matter in Committee. We are consulting and, when we look at the total costs of the scheme, there will be issues to discuss around procurement before funding arrangements become clear. Knowing more fully what is involved, we will be able to take more informed judgments. We have taken no final decisions on these matters. As I explained, we will consult when regulations are put forward, but we have the scope in the regulations to phase differently for smaller or larger employers. We recognise that the reforms should impose the fewest possible burdens on employers of all sizes, and small employers in particular. In developing the policy and operational framework for the reforms, we have engaged with employers and their representatives to ensure that we balance our objectives of increasing access to pension savings while minimising employer burdens. Until operational systems are more fully developed, we cannot predict reliably the final costs of potential administrative burdens. There is no evidence at this stage that financial support would be necessary for small employers. Obviously it would be unwise currently to commit future Governments to spending taxpayers’ money in this way. I would like to re-emphasise our belief that we have taken and will continue to take the necessary steps to get the design of the reforms and the scheme right. Any decision around financial support for employers should rightly be left for future Governments to make, based on the evidence available at the time. As we have said before, we expect staging to occur by business size. However, the decision on how we divide employers into groups is operational. We will not be in a position to consult until we have had detailed input from the Pensions Regulator and PADA on system readiness, but we will consult on regulations that we expect in late 2009. I return to the point that the specific flexibility that the noble Baroness seeks with the amendment is already in the Bill.