Government: Draft Legislative Programme

My Lords, I hope that it is better than my football team. I am sure that there will be opportunities for debate on this matter, and I will talk to my noble and learned friend about it. The noble Lords, Lord Marlesford and Lord De Mauley, raised questions about the proposed EU reform treaty. It is not a constitutional treaty and there is nothing new in it which would require us to change our existing labour and social legislation. Our common law systems of policing and judicial processes will be protected, our independent foreign and defence policies maintained, and our tax and social security systems unaffected. The UK has never held referendums on amending treaties, and here I would just mention the word ““Maastricht”” in that context, to which the party of noble Lords opposite agreed without a referendum. Very important questions have been raised about security and terrorism, and I have noted with interest the comments made. In response to the remarks of the noble Lord, Lord Marlesford, about ID card costs, we reckon that 70 per cent of those costs will be needed in any case simply to bring in more secure fingerprint and biometric passports. I have noted also the comments of the noble Lords, Lord Thomas and Lord Goodhart, about pre-charge detention and the need to strike a general balance between individual liberty and the nation’s security. It is important to consult on those issues and we will listen to what they have to say. The independent reviewer, the noble Lord, Lord Carlile, has been asked to report on our proposals. I know that the noble Lord, Lord McNally, pointed out the breadth of talent on his Benches and that the noble Lord, Lord Carlile, is not thought to have exclusive wisdom in this matter, but he will have a very important input. As to the Criminal Justice and Immigration Bill, I emphasise that the Government are attempting to build public confidence in the sentencing framework by imprisoning serious and dangerous offenders while others receive tough and effective community sentences. The noble Lord, Lord Goodhart, asked about the rebalancing of the criminal justice system in favour of law abiding people and said that it was a good thing. I agree, but not at the expense of a fair trial. I understand the need for a measured approach and the Government will take one. I should say to the right reverend Prelate that of course the rehabilitative and restorative elements of justice are important. I know that he will take a keen interest in that in his new role. I was asked briefly about the legislation for the funding of political parties. All I can say about that is that taking the matter forward is dependent on the outcome of the cross-party talks on the Hayden Phillips reports. The right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Chelmsford, my noble friend Lord Borrie and others referred to the critical importance of housing, particularly affordable, social housing. From the Statement made in your Lordships’ House and the other place this week, noble Lords will know the Government’s clear intent in this area. I understand the point made by my noble friend Lord Brooke about the use of under-utilised land, and I shall arrange a response to him in relation to the detailed matter that he raised. I understand what my noble friend Lady Wilkins said about co-housing communities—both their social contribution and their contribution to sustainability—and what she said about potential adjustments in planning law and regulation. I shall certainly ensure that that is drawn to the attention of the relevant department. I agree with my noble friend Lord Howarth that arts and culture should be seen as a good in themselves and not only in terms of the contribution that they make to other goods in society. From my experience in Birmingham, having high quality, excellent arts is good in itself, but my goodness me, it has not half made a contribution to the confidence of Birmingham in general as well. I hesitate to count up the resource implications of what he and other noble Lords have said. Clearly it brings in the language of priorities and all these matters will need to be considered very carefully. My noble friend Lord Morris made a pertinent point about the need for education and skills to plug the gap. I know that the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, is cautious about the raising of the leaving age, but the question I would put back to her is whether we can afford to neglect these people who have lost out in so many ways. I understand the point she made about the curriculum. My noble friend Lord Haskel talked graphically about some of the people who have fallen through the gap, many of them ending up in our prisons. We have to do something about that. On the employment simplification Bill, I accept the point made by my noble friend Lord Haskell, particularly in relation to conciliation. It echoes the points raised by my noble friend Lord Wedderburn. I should emphasise to my noble friend Lord Wedderburn that my advice is that the only aspect of trade union law that the Bill would deal with is that which is subject to the ASLEF judgment. I shall obviously pass on his comments to the relevant department. On dispute resolution provisions, the Government’s consultation on the Gibbons report finished in late June and we will consider it very carefully. I accept that access is very important. In promoting the early resolution of disputes, which must make sense, employees must have ready access to employment tribunals in order to enforce their rights where necessary. I welcome all the comments made by noble Lords in regard to children in care. They are right: the more we intervene in a positive way to help and enhance the life chances of those young people, the fewer problems we will have later in the system. Those of us who took part in the Children (Leaving Care) Bill some years ago will know how important it is to get that right. I congratulate the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, on raising, yet again, the issue of reasonable chastisement. However, I cannot promise that the Government will respond differently from the way in which we have responded before. As to the Coroners Bill, my noble friend is right to stress the importance of health information. I understand the frustration of the noble Baroness, Lady Miller, and the noble Lord, Lord Teverson, that the Marine Bill has not been published as a substantive Bill. However, it will be published for pre-legislative scrutiny, which will lead to a better Bill in the outcome. I have reached the end of my time. This has been an excellent debate. We have made a very good start on early insight into the Government’s proposals for legislation in the next Session and I can assure noble Lords that we will listen very carefully. I hope that there will be other opportunities to take the debate forward.