Corporate Manslaughter and Corporate Homicide Bill

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, for his robust stand on this issue. To an extent, he has achieved considerable progress. The House Magazine nominated the noble Lord for Peer of the Year and the votes in your Lordships’ House confirmed him as that. He deserves all the congratulations he has received because of the stand that he has taken on this matter. I am disappointed for a number of reasons. When I last looked at the figures, we had, on average, two deaths in custody per week. I am disappointed about the timescale—that it will take another three years before we come to a conclusion on this matter. I am disappointed that in the mean time there will be this exemption; I will explain that. I am also disappointed for those who lost their dear ones through deaths in prison; with future deaths, others will have to wait even longer to reach a conclusion. Our stand has been clear from day one. A law that distinguishes between the private and public sectors—or between the private sector and the private sector working in the public sector, as is the case with prisons—is a bad law. There should be uniform application, but that is lacking. We thank the Minister for her assurance that the Government hope to put the situation right at the end of three years. I am also concerned about the prison population; that was one of the Minister’s arguments. The prison population is increasing day by day in this country and I cannot see that in three years’ time we will be any better off than we are now. The problem will still be there. I also believe that, with the increase in terrorism in this country, accidents will happen, and there may be shootings. There should be some accountability about such deaths. I am disappointed by the long timescale involved. What are the interim plans within the three-year period? It would be helpful if the Minister explained that. We have gone as far as we can on this matter. If the noble Lord presses the amendment there will be further ping-pong, but I understand that he now intends to call it a day; we respect his wishes. If he had called a Division, we on this side would certainly have supported him. However, I promise that the matter will not end when this debate finishes. We will take every available opportunity, in Questions and short debates, to raise this issue until such time as it is on the statute books. Let common sense prevail: our shortcomings and rising prison population should not hinder progress in this very important matter. In conclusion, I thank the Leader of the House for her courtesy and kindness in keeping us informed at every stage. She has truly acted as the Leader of the whole House and we are very grateful to her.