Commissioner for Older People (Wales) Bill [HL]

My Lords, most of your   Lordships would agree that, celebrating my 75th   birthday next month—as I hope to do, God willing—I am reasonably well qualified to talk about the elderly and comment on the Bill. Cicero, one of the great conservatives of the Roman Republic, wrote a treatise on old age when he was about the same tender age as the Minister, which brings me, circuitously, to the key point underlying the Bill. We can now all expect to live longer and so many of us do that the proportion of the population aged over 65 has increased dramatically and will continue to do so, barring another Black Death or some other calamity. I must confess a liking for the Prime Minister’s positive—indeed, spirited approach to this,"““unprecedented change in the fabric of society””," as he describes the growing proportion of elderly in our   communities in his foreword to the Government publication, Opportunity Age—Meeting the challenges of ageing in the 21st century. The Prime Minister writes:"““An ageing society is too often and wrongly seen solely in terms of increasing dependency. But the reality is that, as older people become an ever more significant proportion of the population, society will increasingly depend upon the contribution they can make””." I am glad that the Minister has caught the Prime Minister’s mood in that foreword. The thrust of the entire document is that we must change our ideas about retirement and ageing and seize the positive opportunities. Out goes the early retreat to the golf club and in comes a stay at work to do what we can to pass on our skills and experience, if any. I am told that a million people already work beyond retirement age. I must say that it is an impressive document, but delivering its policy content across the Government and to the public at large will not be easy. I think that the Prime Minister would acknowledge that. A great deal of thinking and discussion about ageing population problems has been going on in Wales, too—and with good reason as, as the Minister said, 22   per cent of our current Welsh population is aged more than 65. There was a report from an advisory group on a strategy for older people titled When I’m 64  . . . and more, which I think owes a little to the Beatles’ song. That was published three years ago and last year, there appeared a second report by the Welsh Assembly Government’s advisory group on a commissioner for older people in Wales. Among the recommendations at the end of the second chapter of that first report is the earliest mention that I have found of the proposed appointment of an older persons’ commissioner. The designation of a Minister as older people’s Minister with an overall responsibility for strategy is another possibility mentioned there. But it is the commissioner proposal that has pride of place, probably because, as the report notes, in Chapter 2 paragraph 9:"““There is considerable evidence  . . . that all is not well for older people. There are problems of poor housing, poverty, poor nutrition, lack of opportunity for employment, education and leisure, inadequate transport services and dissatisfaction with health and welfare provision. People perceive an imbalance of power and influence and a lack of respect. Age is seen as stigmatising and it is perceived that older people are discriminated against””." In short, there are painful inadequacies and regrettable but preventable defects in the existing system of care and provision for the elderly that require urgent attention before more positive policies can be successfully pursued. I detect behind the proposal for an independent Commissioner the strong feelings and influence of organisations like Help the Aged and Age Concern, which have long been engaged with the plight of the elderly and to which we should be deeply grateful for their solicitude. So we now have a Bill to establish the office of Commissioner for Older People on much the same protective and authoritative lines as the Children’s Commissioner. Thirty years ago, we might have established some kind of agency to achieve the same goals, but quangos are no longer in favour or fit for any purpose except fuelling bonfires. Commissioners are now the flavour of the month. A similar proposal was put forward for England in Private Members’ Bills last year and the year before, but the Government have yet to accept it. They would   prefer to rely on stronger central government co-ordination, with leadership from the Department for Work and Pensions, a powerful commission for equality and human rights, a forum led by the Chief Scientific Adviser to harness science and technology to the challenges of ageing, and assessment by the Audit Commission of local authorities’ performance. The Audit Commission, the Commission for Healthcare Audit and Inspection and the Commission for Social Care Inspection are reviewing the National Service Framework for the Elderly and will report soon. All in all, the United Kingdom Government’s paper contains a substantial programme to give a lead to a wide range of players. Noble Lords may wonder why the Assembly Government do not adopt a similar leading role rather than foist the responsibility on a commissioner. Why do they not appoint a vigorous young Minister to safeguard the elderly and promote their interests across the devolved areas of Assembly government? Why should that not suffice? I cannot answer that question fully but it is significant that there is a strong body of opinion among the voluntary organisations that there should be a commissioner, independent of all existing authorities, as the Minister said, and with the right critically to examine them, the Assembly Government included, if they fail to discharge their functions or give rise to complaints. Those organisations call for a champion to defend the rights and promote the interests of the elderly, which suggests that such considerations have not always been foremost in authorities’ minds. The second of the reports to which I referred stresses the need to ensure that,"““the successful candidate has a real understanding of, and empathy with, the life of older people in Wales””" and that the selection and appointment process,"““should meaningfully involve older people””." There is there a real cri de caur—cri o’r galon, as we say   in Welsh—that the commissioner’s first loyalty should be to those whose interests he represents. Some attempt to reflect that appears in the Bill. With regard to the detailed provisions, we are grateful to the Minister for accepting the situation whereby we already face government amendments. The Bill broadly follows the pattern set in the legislation that established the Children’s Commissioner. Noble Lords participated in the passage of that legislation and are familiar with it. I shall note only the differences between the two pieces of legislation as I see them. First, more of the detail in the Bill, such as the terms and duration of the commissioner’s appointment, is left to the National Assembly to sort out in secondary legislation. That increased scope for, and reliance on, secondary legislation is novel and may not find favour with all Members of your Lordships’ House or the other place. It leaves a lot of loose ends that we could well tie up here. I hope that the Assembly has taken to heart the Richard commission’s criticism of its scrutiny, or lack thereof, of secondary legislation and that it will discuss thoroughly such legislation as arises under the Bill and not pass it on the nod. I hope, too, that the Assembly will see sense in an initial appointment for five years, renewable for a further five, subject to high-quality performance. The Minister will recall our debate on that point during the Public Services Ombudsman (Wales) Bill in the previous Session. Secondly, I note that the commissioner for older people will have the same powers as the High Court in respect of the examination of witnesses and the provision of information under Clause 9(7). If he is obstructed or treated with contempt, as described in Clause 10(2), he may issue a certificate to that effect to the High Court, which will deal with the matter appropriately. We had to fight for that procedure in the case of the ombudsman. I wonder what caused the Government’s change of attitude. There may be some argument about the definition of an older person as a person aged 60 or over. The UK Government’s paper refers repeatedly to ““50 plus”” and   so do European studies on ageing problems, primarily because the difficulties of finding alternative employment seem to begin at that age. But I am inclined to leave that disputation until the Committee stage—similarly, the additional costs of setting up the commissioner’s office, amounting to £2 million in the first year. Much could be done for the elderly with such a sum if it were spent directly on meeting their needs. We are reassured that the Bill has been generally welcomed in Wales but I cannot say more because the Assembly will not discuss the Assembly Government’s Motion in support of it until tomorrow. I am assured that it will have Conservative support but I cannot anticipate the views of Plaid Cymru and the Liberal Democrats, which have tabled amendments to the Assembly’s Motion. Coupled with the fact that consultation on the Bill does not end until today and we do not have the Government’s response to that consultation, our debate is a little premature, as the noble Lord acknowledged. But he has put the best face on it, and I accept that. The Bill promises to improve the lot of the elderly in Wales, of which I am one, and that is to be welcomed. It seems right for our times and for our circumstances in Wales.